AHHH....Now that I have your attention...I have been loooking for years ..yes years...on information on my 1928 Montgomery Wards Airline radio. (Yes I posted info about 3 posting ago..sorry for my impatience)
The radio I have is model A-C Eight Type C. It sits in the "Presidntial" style cabinet. (I have the original 1928 Mongomery Wards catalog that shows this)
What I am looking for is a schematic. It has a separate power supply and Neutrodyne reciever serial # C-8029. I want to replace old wax paper capacitor block in the pwer supply but do not know all the values or where the wires go to...The reciever has this tube line-up...5 226s 1 227 2 171s and a 280 in the power pack. Power pack is simular in size to what Atwater Kent used. DOES ANYONE HAVE THE SCHEMATIC FOR THIS IN A SAMS BOOK??? Anyway I WOULD GREATLY APPRECIATE ANY HELP!!!

How long have you been working on radios? I don't think you're going to find a 1928 schematic in Sam's...their schematics didn't start until ~1946. You'll need to look in Rider's for something that old.

:How long have you been working on radios? I don't think you're going to find a 1928 schematic in Sam's...their schematics didn't start until ~1946. You'll need to look in Rider's for something that old.

Ooops ..My bad ....I meant a Riders schematic...

:How long have you been working on radios? I don't think you're going to find a 1928 schematic in Sam's...their schematics didn't start until ~1946. You'll need to look in Rider's for something that old.

Ohhh thats gonna be a hard one to track down... Monty. Wards used different manufactures

:Ooops ..My bad ....I meant a Riders schematic...
:
:
::How long have you been working on radios? I don't think you're going to find a 1928 schematic in Sam's...their schematics didn't start until ~1946. You'll need to look in Rider's for something that old.

ROB..keep your crap off this site

:

Keep asking someone here has got to have that info...

:AHHH....Now that I have your attention...I have been loooking for years ..yes years...on information on my 1928 Montgomery Wards Airline radio. (Yes I posted info about 3 posting ago..sorry for my impatience)
:The radio I have is model A-C Eight Type C. It sits in the "Presidntial" style cabinet. (I have the original 1928 Mongomery Wards catalog that shows this)
:What I am looking for is a schematic. It has a separate power supply and Neutrodyne reciever serial # C-8029. I want to replace old wax paper capacitor block in the pwer supply but do not know all the values or where the wires go to...The reciever has this tube line-up...5 226s 1 227 2 171s and a 280 in the power pack. Power pack is simular in size to what Atwater Kent used. DOES ANYONE HAVE THE SCHEMATIC FOR THIS IN A SAMS BOOK??? Anyway I WOULD GREATLY APPRECIATE ANY HELP!!!

I looked at my Rider's index (vol 1-10) and couldn't find anything from Monty Ward with "AC-8" or "Presidential" in it. I hauled out volume one and couldn't find anything either. After perusing the volume one index I found a set by Day Fan (Day Fan 8). It has the same tube line-up as yours and it's on pg 338. Note that Day Fan may also be under General Motors Radio Corp.

:I looked at my Rider's index (vol 1-10) and couldn't find anything from Monty Ward with "AC-8" or "Presidential" in it. I hauled out volume one and couldn't find anything either. After perusing the volume one index I found a set by Day Fan (Day Fan 8). It has the same tube line-up as yours and it's on pg 338. Note that Day Fan may also be under General Motors Radio Corp.

If you the following, you will find the Day-Fan 8 that Rene is suggesting.

http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/945/M0039945.pdf

Doug

Thanks Rene and Doug...That schematic is close but not exact mine has 10 terminals comming out of power pack and I need a schematic that tells cap values..THANKS THOUGH THAT BROUGHT ME A BIT CLOSER to solving this mystery

::I looked at my Rider's index (vol 1-10) and couldn't find anything from Monty Ward with "AC-8" or "Presidential" in it. I hauled out volume one and couldn't find anything either. After perusing the volume one index I found a set by Day Fan (Day Fan 8). It has the same tube line-up as yours and it's on pg 338. Note that Day Fan may also be under General Motors Radio Corp.
:
:If you the following, you will find the Day-Fan 8 that Rene is suggesting.
:
:http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/945/M0039945.pdf
:
:Doug

:Thanks Rene and Doug...That schematic is close but not exact mine has 10 terminals comming out of power pack and I need a schematic that tells cap values..THANKS THOUGH THAT BROUGHT ME A BIT CLOSER to solving this mystery
:
:::I looked at my Rider's index (vol 1-10) and couldn't find anything from Monty Ward with "AC-8" or "Presidential" in it. I hauled out volume one and couldn't find anything either. After perusing the volume one index I found a set by Day Fan (Day Fan 8). It has the same tube line-up as yours and it's on pg 338. Note that Day Fan may also be under General Motors Radio Corp.
::
::If you the following, you will find the Day-Fan 8 that Rene is suggesting.
::
::http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/945/M0039945.pdf
::
::Doug

There are only two schematics with your tube lineup that has any values for the caps and resistors. One even has 10 terminals out of the power pac. Here they are:

http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/054/M0040054.pdf

http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/659/M0000659.pdf

One is Allied 8/9 AC, and the other is Howard, Green Diamond 8.

You may have already looked at these, but that is all I found with that tube lineup. If these are not close enough, you may be out of luck.

I do have to say I like reading your posts Mr. Berg, cause you sure do get some interesting replies, keep up the "good work". LOL

Doug

You may have a real oddball set. I have a Bush & Lane Model 2 that to this day I cannot find a schematic for. I ended up drawing my own (had to empty out two big tar boxes) and then I used a variety of Rider schematics that were close to get an idea of component values.

Yes..I agree...this set has the separate power pack but..thank god only the caps are sealed in wax...Someone has got to know who made this...It was sold by Wards and they were massed produce..Who made the electonic guts for early Wards sets..maybe that will help me..Any Ideas?

:You may have a real oddball set. I have a Bush & Lane Model 2 that to this day I cannot find a schematic for. I ended up drawing my own (had to empty out two big tar boxes) and then I used a variety of Rider schematics that were close to get an idea of component values.

I have quite a mystery on my hands...If you read previous posting(s) I am having difficulty finding a schematic for my Montgomery Wards ..Airline set..It is a 1928 model AC-8 type C...I am hoping that someone has or knows where to find a schematic for it...The radio has separate power pack (about the same size as Atwater Kent used in their early models like the 37-44 models)..In the power pack the caps sealed in wax..all other electronics are not sealed in tar so I can get to them...ANYWAY..I would like to find a schematic to rplace the caps...The reciever is a neutrodynne reciver with serial number C-8029...ANYONE KNOW WHO MADE THE EARLY AC SETS FOR WARDS...??

:Yes..I agree...this set has the separate power pack but..thank god only the caps are sealed in wax...Someone has got to know who made this...It was sold by Wards and they were massed produce..Who made the electonic guts for early Wards sets..maybe that will help me..Any Ideas?
:
::You may have a real oddball set. I have a Bush & Lane Model 2 that to this day I cannot find a schematic for. I ended up drawing my own (had to empty out two big tar boxes) and then I used a variety of Rider schematics that were close to get an idea of component values.

Neither Airline or Montgomery Ward's show up in Alan Douglas's "Radio Manufacturer's of the 1920's"

If you're lucky enough to find a 3 digit RMA code somewhere, you should be able to determine the manufacturer IF this code was even in effect when your set was made.

:I have quite a mystery on my hands...If you read previous posting(s) I am having difficulty finding a schematic for my Montgomery Wards ..Airline set..It is a 1928 model AC-8 type C...I am hoping that someone has or knows where to find a schematic for it...The radio has separate power pack (about the same size as Atwater Kent used in their early models like the 37-44 models)..In the power pack the caps sealed in wax..all other electronics are not sealed in tar so I can get to them...ANYWAY..I would like to find a schematic to rplace the caps...The reciever is a neutrodynne reciver with serial number C-8029...ANYONE KNOW WHO MADE THE EARLY AC SETS FOR WARDS...??
:
:
::Yes..I agree...this set has the separate power pack but..thank god only the caps are sealed in wax...Someone has got to know who made this...It was sold by Wards and they were massed produce..Who made the electonic guts for early Wards sets..maybe that will help me..Any Ideas?
::
:::You may have a real oddball set. I have a Bush & Lane Model 2 that to this day I cannot find a schematic for. I ended up drawing my own (had to empty out two big tar boxes) and then I used a variety of Rider schematics that were close to get an idea of component values.

Typical electrolytic filter cap values were quite low back in the day compared to modern design, in the order of 1 or 2 uF @ 450 volts. You are probably OK with 6 to 10 uF. The only caution would be the inrush of current when the cap charges up at turn-on with the higher values.

When you are dealing with tuned filters (which often use caps around 1 MFD, +/- 4 MFD), using non-original values for replacements may or may not increase hum. If 8 to 10 MFD doesn't work as a non-original value, you might consider using 20 or 30 MFD. However, 8 to 10 MFD usually works well as a non-original value in those old tuned filters.

Also, with tuned filters, there often is a small cap around .09 MFD across a filter choke. That is part of the tuned circuit. Do not replace that cap with a larger value cap. A larger value will only bypass hum across the choke. It is best to eliminate this cap all together when other filter caps are increased from their original values. Of course, as was said before, if you wish to maintain the tuned filter circuit, all original values must be used, including the cap across the choke.

T.

:AHHH....Now that I have your attention...I have been loooking for years ..yes years...on information on my 1928 Montgomery Wards Airline radio. (Yes I posted info about 3 posting ago..sorry for my impatience)
:The radio I have is model A-C Eight Type C. It sits in the "Presidntial" style cabinet. (I have the original 1928 Mongomery Wards catalog that shows this)
:What I am looking for is a schematic. It has a separate power supply and Neutrodyne reciever serial # C-8029. I want to replace old wax paper capacitor block in the pwer supply but do not know all the values or where the wires go to...The reciever has this tube line-up...5 226s 1 227 2 171s and a 280 in the power pack. Power pack is simular in size to what Atwater Kent used. DOES ANYONE HAVE THE SCHEMATIC FOR THIS IN A SAMS BOOK??? Anyway I WOULD GREATLY APPRECIATE ANY HELP!!!

I did mention your radio to another old time radio collector. He seems to think it's a Freshman. I did look at some of the schematics, and those seem to be very close to what you have.

Have you checked Riders/U.S Radio And Television

Under the Name Apex?

Might be under the model Apex36 or 37 Heading or somewhere around that series?

Yah I think this is a odd ball..set Apex 36-37 Models are close but my set has one more 71 tube I SEE THE NUMBER 842 stamped on the tuner bracket..that may be something..but i don't know what to make of it...Maybe of Freshman mnfct..hmm will look at that...THANKS FOR ALL YOUR SUGGESTIONS..Since I am not all that of an expert ant electronics..(not yet anyway..lol) I really don't wana dig into the block of caps just yet....I will have to study the leads out of power pack to radio and compare to diagrams like Apex 36 & 37 they seem to be close

:Have you checked Riders/U.S Radio And Television
:
:Under the Name Apex?
:
:Might be under the model Apex36 or 37 Heading or somewhere around that series?

OHH HEY one more thing..the reciever has bright shiny copper plated cans on neutrodyne reciever reciver (serial # C-8029

:Yah I think this is a odd ball..set Apex 36-37 Models are close but my set has one more 71 tube I SEE THE NUMBER 842 stamped on the tuner bracket..that may be something..but i don't know what to make of it...Maybe of Freshman mnfct..hmm will look at that...THANKS FOR ALL YOUR SUGGESTIONS..Since I am not all that of an expert ant electronics..(not yet anyway..lol) I really don't wana dig into the block of caps just yet....I will have to study the leads out of power pack to radio and compare to diagrams like Apex 36 & 37 they seem to be close
:
::Have you checked Riders/U.S Radio And Television
::
::Under the Name Apex?
::
::Might be under the model Apex36 or 37 Heading or somewhere around that series?

G.Berg, I believe they are Mershon caps. Take a look on Chuck's site (phicorepairbench), he has instructions for stuffing them. PL

:OHH HEY one more thing..the reciever has bright shiny copper plated cans on neutrodyne reciever reciver (serial # C-8029
:
::Yah I think this is a odd ball..set Apex 36-37 Models are close but my set has one more 71 tube I SEE THE NUMBER 842 stamped on the tuner bracket..that may be something..but i don't know what to make of it...Maybe of Freshman mnfct..hmm will look at that...THANKS FOR ALL YOUR SUGGESTIONS..Since I am not all that of an expert ant electronics..(not yet anyway..lol) I really don't wana dig into the block of caps just yet....I will have to study the leads out of power pack to radio and compare to diagrams like Apex 36 & 37 they seem to be close
::
:::Have you checked Riders/U.S Radio And Television
:::
:::Under the Name Apex?
:::
:::Might be under the model Apex36 or 37 Heading or somewhere around that series?

I should of been more descriptive..these are not caps ..I am familiar with the Mersh. caps ..this set uses a block of caps in wax..The cans I am refering to cover the I.F (?) transformers..cardboard tubes with wire wrapped on them and seales in wax....

: G.Berg, I believe they are Mershon caps. Take a look on Chuck's site (phicorepairbench), he has instructions for stuffing them. PL
:
:
::OHH HEY one more thing..the reciever has bright shiny copper plated cans on neutrodyne reciever reciver (serial # C-8029
::
:::Yah I think this is a odd ball..set Apex 36-37 Models are close but my set has one more 71 tube I SEE THE NUMBER 842 stamped on the tuner bracket..that may be something..but i don't know what to make of it...Maybe of Freshman mnfct..hmm will look at that...THANKS FOR ALL YOUR SUGGESTIONS..Since I am not all that of an expert ant electronics..(not yet anyway..lol) I really don't wana dig into the block of caps just yet....I will have to study the leads out of power pack to radio and compare to diagrams like Apex 36 & 37 they seem to be close
:::
::::Have you checked Riders/U.S Radio And Television
::::
::::Under the Name Apex?
::::
::::Might be under the model Apex36 or 37 Heading or somewhere around that series?

I believe i have found the long lost schematic I have been looking for..THANKS TO ALL THOSE WHO GAVE SUGGESTIONS AND HELP!!! It only took me 10 years....yes 10 years...I did not know of this forum till about a year ago....ANYWAY I belive the DAY-FAN model 25 (Day Fan AC-8)schematic is it ..or. atleast VERY close... The tube line up(on chassis) is exactly the same...Mine does not use a dynamic speaker..rather just one part of a headset ..like that used on old stye horn speakers.....THE QUESTION I POSE IS...On the schematic (Day Fan AC-8 the one with 10 terminals comming out of power pack)..I don't see any values for caps ...8 of them..(#s 5,6,9,7,5,5,5,5) Any suggestions ..or anyone have this page in a riders book I?? THANK YOU FOR ANY HELP!!!!!

:AHHH....Now that I have your attention...I have been loooking for years ..yes years...on information on my 1928 Montgomery Wards Airline radio. (Yes I posted info about 3 posting ago..sorry for my impatience)
:The radio I have is model A-C Eight Type C. It sits in the "Presidntial" style cabinet. (I have the original 1928 Mongomery Wards catalog that shows this)
:What I am looking for is a schematic. It has a separate power supply and Neutrodyne reciever serial # C-8029. I want to replace old wax paper capacitor block in the pwer supply but do not know all the values or where the wires go to...The reciever has this tube line-up...5 226s 1 227 2 171s and a 280 in the power pack. Power pack is simular in size to what Atwater Kent used. DOES ANYONE HAVE THE SCHEMATIC FOR THIS IN A SAMS BOOK??? Anyway I WOULD GREATLY APPRECIATE ANY HELP!!!

:I believe i have found the long lost schematic I have been looking for..THANKS TO ALL THOSE WHO GAVE SUGGESTIONS AND HELP!!! It only took me 10 years....yes 10 years...I did not know of this forum till about a year ago....ANYWAY I belive the DAY-FAN model 25 (Day Fan AC-8)schematic is it ..or. atleast VERY close... The tube line up(on chassis) is exactly the same...Mine does not use a dynamic speaker..rather just one part of a headset ..like that used on old stye horn speakers.....THE QUESTION I POSE IS...On the schematic (Day Fan AC-8 the one with 10 terminals comming out of power pack)..I don't see any values for caps ...8 of them..(#s 5,6,9,7,5,5,5,5) Any suggestions ..or anyone have this page in a riders book I?? THANK YOU FOR ANY HELP!!!!!
:
:
::AHHH....Now that I have your attention...I have been loooking for years ..yes years...on information on my 1928 Montgomery Wards Airline radio. (Yes I posted info about 3 posting ago..sorry for my impatience)
::The radio I have is model A-C Eight Type C. It sits in the "Presidntial" style cabinet. (I have the original 1928 Mongomery Wards catalog that shows this)
::What I am looking for is a schematic. It has a separate power supply and Neutrodyne reciever serial # C-8029. I want to replace old wax paper capacitor block in the pwer supply but do not know all the values or where the wires go to...The reciever has this tube line-up...5 226s 1 227 2 171s and a 280 in the power pack. Power pack is simular in size to what Atwater Kent used. DOES ANYONE HAVE THE SCHEMATIC FOR THIS IN A SAMS BOOK??? Anyway I WOULD GREATLY APPRECIATE ANY HELP!!!

I took a look at a few of those Day Fan schematics. Seems none say what the values are in that capacitor block. However, the Freshman prints do. I think if you follow the Freshman print as to where the capacitors connect to, should be able to come up with working values.

::I believe i have found the long lost schematic I have been looking for..THANKS TO ALL THOSE WHO GAVE SUGGESTIONS AND HELP!!! It only took me 10 years....yes 10 years...I did not know of this forum till about a year ago....ANYWAY I belive the DAY-FAN model 25 (Day Fan AC-8)schematic is it ..or. atleast VERY close... The tube line up(on chassis) is exactly the same...Mine does not use a dynamic speaker..rather just one part of a headset ..like that used on old stye horn speakers.....THE QUESTION I POSE IS...On the schematic (Day Fan AC-8 the one with 10 terminals comming out of power pack)..I don't see any values for caps ...8 of them..(#s 5,6,9,7,5,5,5,5) Any suggestions ..or anyone have this page in a riders book I?? THANK YOU FOR ANY HELP!!!!!
::
::
:::AHHH....Now that I have your attention...I have been loooking for years ..yes years...on information on my 1928 Montgomery Wards Airline radio. (Yes I posted info about 3 posting ago..sorry for my impatience)
:::The radio I have is model A-C Eight Type C. It sits in the "Presidntial" style cabinet. (I have the original 1928 Mongomery Wards catalog that shows this)
:::What I am looking for is a schematic. It has a separate power supply and Neutrodyne reciever serial # C-8029. I want to replace old wax paper capacitor block in the pwer supply but do not know all the values or where the wires go to...The reciever has this tube line-up...5 226s 1 227 2 171s and a 280 in the power pack. Power pack is simular in size to what Atwater Kent used. DOES ANYONE HAVE THE SCHEMATIC FOR THIS IN A SAMS BOOK??? Anyway I WOULD GREATLY APPRECIATE ANY HELP!!!
:
:I took a look at a few of those Day Fan schematics. Seems none say what the values are in that capacitor block. However, the Freshman prints do. I think if you follow the Freshman print as to where the capacitors connect to, should be able to come up with working values.