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us radio and television model 80 tone
1/23/2008 3:17:23 PMsean
Hello Im still trying to see if theres anything I can do to get better tone on this radio. The only caps I see re c6 and c7 on the actual radio that are paper ones tied to ground but I dont see any others. I see the schematic says n-1 through n-5. The symbol looks like a cap but why is it labeled n.
1/23/2008 4:40:00 PMEdd




Hey man….that unit is wayyyyy toooo old to be Hi i i Fi.i i !

The tonal reproduction / voicing probably seeming to be associated with the transducer…. AND its condition… that is connected onto the output terminals of the receiver.

And we would assume that the unit is sounding too tinny…not enough bass….right ?

Plus the iron characteristics of the driver and output transformers….just in case an earlier inadequate substitution of them has or had been made.

Your referenced “ N “ series marked capacitors are RF neutralization caps that are associated with the frontal TRF design of receiver, well before your detection area where the audio is stripped from the RF to make your audio for the set..

The only other actual caps that I see that would be having tonal affectation would be the C6 / 7 capacitors in their bypassing the B+ side of the audio driver transformer…..but the on site schema does not give their values.

If they were deficient, there would be a drop off of the bass response of that stage…HOWEVER…. since it is also bypassing the RF stages supply, most assuredly those stages would have been squealing, howling prior to that degradation required for onset at the audio stage. BUT….I have seen a time where that type of filtering had degraded to the point where an ESR test of a unit, had revealed it to be no more effective than a .1 ufd cap, rather than an approximate marked value of 8-10 ufd. Naturally that would not cut it in the bypassing of audio frequencies, but was still just on the threshold of bypassing RF frequencies with that .1 ufd of capacitance being presented.
Lastly, you probably have replaced that unit with a fresh new unit….right ?

Typical tone control technique is to have a smaller value of capacitor in the 1st grid OR plate circuitry tubes so, in that selective manner, it is taking the very higher AF frequencies and stripping them off and bypassing them to ground. Then the old ear hears the effect and says….. “Hey I’s gots ‘mo bass ! “…not really…just as being perceived in that manner. The other mode is initially assuring that max bass frequencies are actually being passed thru the audio serially arranged audio stages.
Say that you had a .01 ufd cap coupling from a plate supply to the following grid, the use of an .05 would typically enhance the lower frequencies being passed.

IF there were good bass frequencies, right from the detector stage, and usually that is true, down to the degree that the signal is providing from the station and its actual song / instrument / music source. In your case you just have old brute force transformer coupling.
So somehow I might think that your problem…if insufficient bass related….. IT SOUNDS TOO TINNY !.... might be still reproducer related.

Any more TRF dudes comments , from the balcony ?



73's de Edd






:Hello Im still trying to see if theres anything I can do to get better tone on this radio. The only caps I see re c6 and c7 on the actual radio that are paper ones tied to ground but I dont see any others. I see the schematic says n-1 through n-5. The symbol looks like a cap but why is it labeled n.

1/24/2008 4:03:49 AMsean
:actually I think the set needs more treble. No I havnt replaced c6 and c7 yet. The last time I played it I Noted it was playing but cutting out as in choppy playing..so hmmmm cap going bad?.........I have already recapped the powersupply, and oh boy was that fun....not. All other paper caps have been replaced under the chassis other than c6 and c7. the neutralizing caps havnt been touched
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:Hey man….that unit is wayyyyy toooo old to be Hi i i Fi.i i !
:
:The tonal reproduction / voicing probably seeming to be associated with the transducer…. AND its condition… that is connected onto the output terminals of the receiver.
:
:
:And we would assume that the unit is sounding too tinny…not enough bass….right ?
:
:Plus the iron characteristics of the driver and output transformers….just in case an earlier inadequate substitution of them has or had been made.
:
:Your referenced “ N “ series marked capacitors are RF neutralization caps that are associated with the frontal TRF design of receiver, well before your detection area where the audio is stripped from the RF to make your audio for the set..
:
: The only other actual caps that I see that would be having tonal affectation would be the C6 / 7 capacitors in their bypassing the B+ side of the audio driver transformer…..but the on site schema does not give their values.
:
:If they were deficient, there would be a drop off of the bass response of that stage…HOWEVER…. since it is also bypassing the RF stages supply, most assuredly those stages would have been squealing, howling prior to that degradation required for onset at the audio stage. BUT….I have seen a time where that type of filtering had degraded to the point where an ESR test of a unit, had revealed it to be no more effective than a .1 ufd cap, rather than an approximate marked value of 8-10 ufd. Naturally that would not cut it in the bypassing of audio frequencies, but was still just on the threshold of bypassing RF frequencies with that .1 ufd of capacitance being presented.
:Lastly, you probably have replaced that unit with a fresh new unit….right ?
:
:Typical tone control technique is to have a smaller value of capacitor in the 1st grid OR plate circuitry tubes so, in that selective manner, it is taking the very higher AF frequencies and stripping them off and bypassing them to ground. Then the old ear hears the effect and says….. “Hey I’s gots ‘mo bass ! “…not really…just as being perceived in that manner. The other mode is initially assuring that max bass frequencies are actually being passed thru the audio serially arranged audio stages.
:Say that you had a .01 ufd cap coupling from a plate supply to the following grid, the use of an .05 would typically enhance the lower frequencies being passed.
:
:IF there were good bass frequencies, right from the detector stage, and usually that is true, down to the degree that the signal is providing from the station and its actual song / instrument / music source. In your case you just have old brute force transformer coupling.
:So somehow I might think that your problem…if insufficient bass related….. IT SOUNDS TOO TINNY !.... might be still reproducer related.
:
:
:Any more TRF dudes comments , from the balcony ?
:
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:
:
:73's de Edd
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::Hello Im still trying to see if theres anything I can do to get better tone on this radio. The only caps I see re c6 and c7 on the actual radio that are paper ones tied to ground but I dont see any others. I see the schematic says n-1 through n-5. The symbol looks like a cap but why is it labeled n.


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