With all the developments in communications, the AM band now appears to be the red-headed stepchild of them all - hosting mostly talk / sports / news. For that matter, shortwave programs are becoming fewer and far inbetween. Of course, it is easier to "podcast" than have a big studio and transmitter. I've heard talk of internet over power lines that may produce so much interference it will render some ham bands unusable. Cell phones easily supplant the need for a ham shack. How about some of you guys "in the know" commenting on the future of radio as we know it.....

Hi

We are already to the point people are building transmitters so they can send music to their AM radios. Our local stations have talk/sports/news. Even then interference from lights, computers and other electronic divices destroy AM reception.

I collect radios but have noticed prices are down over the past 10 years or so. A few rare ones may hold their price? People collect what they remember from childhood. In time these radios will just be something found in museums. Hopefully it doesn't happen too soon.

Norm

:With all the developments in communications, the AM band now appears to be the red-headed stepchild of them all - hosting mostly talk / sports / news. For that matter, shortwave programs are becoming fewer and far inbetween. Of course, it is easier to "podcast" than have a big studio and transmitter. I've heard talk of internet over power lines that may produce so much interference it will render some ham bands unusable. Cell phones easily supplant the need for a ham shack. How about some of you guys "in the know" commenting on the future of radio as we know it.....

:Hi
:
: We are already to the point people are building transmitters so they can send music to their AM radios. Our local stations have talk/sports/news. Even then interference from lights, computers and other electronic divices destroy AM reception.
:
: I collect radios but have noticed prices are down over the past 10 years or so. A few rare ones may hold their price? People collect what they remember from childhood. In time these radios will just be something found in museums. Hopefully it doesn't happen too soon.
:
:Norm
:
::With all the developments in communications, the AM band now appears to be the red-headed stepchild of them all - hosting mostly talk / sports / news. For that matter, shortwave programs are becoming fewer and far inbetween. Of course, it is easier to "podcast" than have a big studio and transmitter. I've heard talk of internet over power lines that may produce so much interference it will render some ham bands unusable. Cell phones easily supplant the need for a ham shack. How about some of you guys "in the know" commenting on the future of radio as we know it.....

Aren't the top-rated radio stations in many major markets still on the AM side (ie, WTMJ 620AM in Milwaukee, WABC 770AM in NYC, WGN 720AM in Chicago, etc)?

Also, I think that it was internet relay chat (IRC) and the various internet instant messenger programs - as well as forvms like this one - that supplanted the 'Ham' shacks. I can literally talk to anyone anywhere in the world using those programs and without the hassles and expenses that come with learning the theory, licensing and the otherwise elaborate equipment required for amateur radio.

One does have to realize that most programming in the 'Golden' era of radio was news, sports, scheduled narrative programs and live remotes - also some current-affairs talk (ie, FDR's Fireside Chats). There was also a healthy amount of music, much of it broadcast live/remote, but not anywhere near the quantity nor sound quality of what is heard on FM today.

If anything, get one of those ultra-low power AM transmitters and use your iPod to feed one of those literally hundreds of thousands of OTR shows available free or cheap via downloading or on CDs/DVDs into your antique radio.

Mike

We used to have a great AM station in Houston that played oldies from the "Swing" and Big Band Era, but now the format is all sports. It was great to hear music from the same era my old radios were made. I guess I'm gonna have to build an AM transmitter.
As for BPL (Broadband-Over-Powerline), this is a serious threat to all HF radio communications, and the FCC doesn't seem to care about interference to licensed services. Most BPL technology is seriously flawed, but the FCC seems to favor the political pressure from the current administration to provide cheap broadband internet access to the masses. Most power company trials have failed miserably from an economic standpoint with heavy competition from cable, DSL, dial-up, and satellite providers. BPL doesn't make sense to provide broadband service to rural customers since many amps and repeaters will be needed. Economics may NOT be a factor however if ALL electric utility rate payers get socked for a upcharge whether they subscribe to BPL or not. Isn't our electric bill high enough already? Don't forget that another goal of BPL could be to read meters remotely, and provide another avenue of grid control. Unshielded power lines were never meant to carry RF signals, and battles are being waged here and abroad over this issue. NATO recently gave BPL a blistering report, and the American Radio Relay League (ARRL) www.arrl.org which represents over 152,000 hams has been fighting this tooth and nail. The ARRL is now sueing the FCC for not enforcing its own rules. It seems like another valuable asset to homeland security is put in serious jeopardy by a politically misguided government agency. Sorry for the bandwidth, but this is really a hot button issue for me after being a licensed ham for 40 years.
Steve

:We used to have a great AM station in Houston that played oldies from the "Swing" and Big Band Era, but now the format is all sports. It was great to hear music from the same era my old radios were made. I guess I'm gonna have to build an AM transmitter.
:As for BPL (Broadband-Over-Powerline), this is a serious threat to all HF radio communications, and the FCC doesn't seem to care about interference to licensed services. Most BPL technology is seriously flawed, but the FCC seems to favor the political pressure from the current administration to provide cheap broadband internet access to the masses. Most power company trials have failed miserably from an economic standpoint with heavy competition from cable, DSL, dial-up, and satellite providers. BPL doesn't make sense to provide broadband service to rural customers since many amps and repeaters will be needed. Economics may NOT be a factor however if ALL electric utility rate payers get socked for a upcharge whether they subscribe to BPL or not. Isn't our electric bill high enough already? Don't forget that another goal of BPL could be to read meters remotely, and provide another avenue of grid control. Unshielded power lines were never meant to carry RF signals, and battles are being waged here and abroad over this issue. NATO recently gave BPL a blistering report, and the American Radio Relay League (ARRL) www.arrl.org which represents over 152,000 hams has been fighting this tooth and nail. The ARRL is now sueing the FCC for not enforcing its own rules. It seems like another valuable asset to homeland security is put in serious jeopardy by a politically misguided government agency. Sorry for the bandwidth, but this is really a hot button issue for me after being a licensed ham for 40 years.
:Steve

I share your concerns.

Our local power utility already reads its meters using signals sent over their power lines and has for a couple of years now. I only heard interference from it on my AM car radio (and only when listening to some out-of-town stations while driving under them) along one of their major local lines, but it has been well over a year now since I have heard that interference.

Mike
Appleton, WI

::We used to have a great AM station in Houston that played oldies from the "Swing" and Big Band Era, but now the format is all sports. It was great to hear music from the same era my old radios were made. I guess I'm gonna have to build an AM transmitter.
::As for BPL (Broadband-Over-Powerline), this is a serious threat to all HF radio communications, and the FCC doesn't seem to care about interference to licensed services. Most BPL technology is seriously flawed, but the FCC seems to favor the political pressure from the current administration to provide cheap broadband internet access to the masses. Most power company trials have failed miserably from an economic standpoint with heavy competition from cable, DSL, dial-up, and satellite providers. BPL doesn't make sense to provide broadband service to rural customers since many amps and repeaters will be needed. Economics may NOT be a factor however if ALL electric utility rate payers get socked for a upcharge whether they subscribe to BPL or not. Isn't our electric bill high enough already? Don't forget that another goal of BPL could be to read meters remotely, and provide another avenue of grid control. Unshielded power lines were never meant to carry RF signals, and battles are being waged here and abroad over this issue. NATO recently gave BPL a blistering report, and the American Radio Relay League (ARRL) www.arrl.org which represents over 152,000 hams has been fighting this tooth and nail. The ARRL is now sueing the FCC for not enforcing its own rules. It seems like another valuable asset to homeland security is put in serious jeopardy by a politically misguided government agency. Sorry for the bandwidth, but this is really a hot button issue for me after being a licensed ham for 40 years.
::Steve
:
:I share your concerns.
:
:Our local power utility already reads its meters using signals sent over their power lines and has for a couple of years now. I only heard interference from it on my AM car radio (and only when listening to some out-of-town stations while driving under them) along one of their major local lines, but it has been well over a year now since I have heard that interference.
:
:Mike
:Appleton, WI

Mike,
I remember as a kid when we only had AM in the car and you'd always hear interference when you drove under powerlines. Is what you are hearing an different from that? And, does it send a continious signal or intermittent?

If you want to see and hear what a BPL system can do to the HF spectrum, here's a couple of links worth visiting:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gsxpya3CnQ

http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2004/06/18/8/BPL-and-HF-web.mpg

Steve

::I share your concerns.
::
::Our local power utility already reads its meters using signals sent over their power lines and has for a couple of years now. I only heard interference from it on my AM car radio (and only when listening to some out-of-town stations while driving under them) along one of their major local lines, but it has been well over a year now since I have heard that interference.
::
::Mike
::Appleton, WI
:
:Mike,
:I remember as a kid when we only had AM in the car and you'd always hear interference when you drove under powerlines. Is what you are hearing an different from that? And, does it send a continious signal or intermittent?

Yea, it sounded like some sort of comm signals that cycled every few (3-5 or so) seconds, with each cycle sounding slightly different from the one before. It was definitely not that nasty 60 Hz/3 phase stuff that you normally hear under many higher-energy power lines.

Mike

:
:::I share your concerns.
:::
:::Our local power utility already reads its meters using signals sent over their power lines and has for a couple of years now. I only heard interference from it on my AM car radio (and only when listening to some out-of-town stations while driving under them) along one of their major local lines, but it has been well over a year now since I have heard that interference.
:::
:::Mike
:::Appleton, WI
::
::Mike,
::I remember as a kid when we only had AM in the car and you'd always hear interference when you drove under powerlines. Is what you are hearing an different from that? And, does it send a continious signal or intermittent?
:
:Yea, it sounded like some sort of comm signals that cycled every few (3-5 or so) seconds, with each cycle sounding slightly different from the one before. It was definitely not that nasty 60 Hz/3 phase stuff that you normally hear under many higher-energy power lines.

Also, it sounded like a call was being sent out to a particular meter and that meter was immediately responding.

Mike

::
::::I share your concerns.
::::
::::Our local power utility already reads its meters using signals sent over their power lines and has for a couple of years now. I only heard interference from it on my AM car radio (and only when listening to some out-of-town stations while driving under them) along one of their major local lines, but it has been well over a year now since I have heard that interference.
::::
::::Mike
::::Appleton, WI
:::
:::Mike,
:::I remember as a kid when we only had AM in the car and you'd always hear interference when you drove under powerlines. Is what you are hearing an different from that? And, does it send a continious signal or intermittent?
::
::Yea, it sounded like some sort of comm signals that cycled every few (3-5 or so) seconds, with each cycle sounding slightly different from the one before. It was definitely not that nasty 60 Hz/3 phase stuff that you normally hear under many higher-energy power lines.
:
:Also, it sounded like a call was being sent out to a particular meter and that meter was immediately responding.
:
:Mike

All:
Our power company here in Georgia, can turn off air conditioners for five minutes per hour when their demand becomes too great. They cycle through various homes and businesses, and there is a grey box they applied outside the house where the compressor is located. I adked the installers how these things worked, and they said "by radio". I assumed there was a V or U HF receiver in the box, but those things may be some of the interference I get on my AM band, both at home and on the road. Maybe I can find some info on the internet, will share if I can.

Lewis

Here's a few more short audio files from Australia of what BPL sounds like on the shortwave bands. The format is mp3.

http://reast.asn.au/soundfiles/MtNelsonBPL80mVK7HCK.mp3

http://reast.asn.au/soundfiles/MtNelson15m.mp3

http://reast.asn.au/soundfiles/MtNelson20m.mp3

::We used to have a great AM station in Houston that played oldies from the "Swing" and Big Band Era, but now the format is all sports. It was great to hear music from the same era my old radios were made. I guess I'm gonna have to build an AM transmitter.
::As for BPL (Broadband-Over-Powerline), this is a serious threat to all HF radio communications, and the FCC doesn't seem to care about interference to licensed services. Most BPL technology is seriously flawed, but the FCC seems to favor the political pressure from the current administration to provide cheap broadband internet access to the masses. Most power company trials have failed miserably from an economic standpoint with heavy competition from cable, DSL, dial-up, and satellite providers. BPL doesn't make sense to provide broadband service to rural customers since many amps and repeaters will be needed. Economics may NOT be a factor however if ALL electric utility rate payers get socked for a upcharge whether they subscribe to BPL or not. Isn't our electric bill high enough already? Don't forget that another goal of BPL could be to read meters remotely, and provide another avenue of grid control. Unshielded power lines were never meant to carry RF signals, and battles are being waged here and abroad over this issue. NATO recently gave BPL a blistering report, and the American Radio Relay League (ARRL) www.arrl.org which represents over 152,000 hams has been fighting this tooth and nail. The ARRL is now sueing the FCC for not enforcing its own rules. It seems like another valuable asset to homeland security is put in serious jeopardy by a politically misguided government agency. Sorry for the bandwidth, but this is really a hot button issue for me after being a licensed ham for 40 years.
::Steve
:

Hey, Steve, I worked my *** off to get a first class radiotelephone ticket, and worked in AM, FM, TV, for AT&T, and Delta Air Lines, where a FCC license was mandatory. Then, they did away with the requirement, and now, I guess, anybody can walk in off the street and become a radio engineer. I guess this goes with the transistors going to the Orient, etc, etc,. It looks like we raise the grades in this country by lowering the standards. And I think that ALL hams ought to know the Morse code, even if they never use it. Dididit Dahdahdah Dah didididit dit didadit dit.

Didahdidit dit didahdah didit dididit.

I agree Lewis. We keep dumbing things down to get more people in. The ranks would continue to shrink if we didn't. Take a look at any ham club meeting now, and virtually everyone there has gray hair. On the other hand, the really old timers probably think the same about our generation. The easier it gets, the less the accomplishment is appreciated by the newest members.
73,
Steve

I tend to think that the AM broadcast band will be around for quite a long while, although the programming will still be talk, talk, and more talk. In the Chicago area, for example, I watch the ratings of various AM and FM broadcast stations - and AM stations remain quite popular. And the value of AM stations when they are sold remains high, so they must be profitable.

Digital broadcasting on the AM band seems to be picking up. This is dual analog and digital - WBBM in Chicago is an example. But the range of the digital channel is supposedly quite a bit shorter than the analog, and the digital signal strength has to be turned down at night (seems contradictory).

Actually, AM isn't the greatest medium for hi-fi music anyway - the higher frequencies get cut off due to frequency bandwidth allocations. FM is better, but those stations overly compress their music (so ppp sounds like p and fff sounds like f). (This caters to listeners in autos with loud background noise.) This audio compression with FM annoys me - I use an audio expander in between my hi-fi FM tuner and amplifier, which helps greatly.

Norm observes that antique radio receivers have been declining in value. Nowadays, some of my non-collector friends like the nostalgia of a pre-war, wood-cabinet cathedral radio, and are appreciative when I offer to give them one. But I can hardly give away 1920s-era TRFs in metal cabinets.

Interestingly, some younger people seem to like the looks of a pre-war wooden console, even though they live in small apartments in the city. I have no trouble finding homes for such consoles, even ones that seem a little unattractive to me.
Doug

:With all the developments in communications, the AM band now appears to be the red-headed stepchild of them all - hosting mostly talk / sports / news. For that matter, shortwave programs are becoming fewer and far inbetween. Of course, it is easier to "podcast" than have a big studio and transmitter. I've heard talk of internet over power lines that may produce so much interference it will render some ham bands unusable. Cell phones easily supplant the need for a ham shack. How about some of you guys "in the know" commenting on the future of radio as we know it.....

Good info Doug. I wasn't aware that WBBM was transmitting in both modes. I can hear them most winter nights down in Houston, and recently received them quite loud in the car while driving to Georgia. It demonstrates what "Clear Channel" radio is all about. Digital is definitely less forgiving with weak signals than analog is. Digital is great when the signal strength is up, but drops out completely when things get marginal. With the poorest analog signal, you can still get some information through. I think AM radio will be around for quite some time yet. It's just the formats that are less appealing for the most part.
Steve

Is'digital' broadcast the same as this 'high-definition' broadcast that the powerhouses are touting to impress listeners with? How 'bout programming? It's all in the ratings! I have 'C-Quam' AM stereo in my car and enjoy DXing for stereo signals.(The long-distance season is appoaching!) The initial excitment for AM stereo in the mid-eighties made it look like music was coming back to the AM band. Listening to a voice in stereo doesn't do much for me,I have to admit. The 'Kahn' format(which uses both sidebands for left and right channels) as opposed to 'C-Quam' (which uses an 'FM style' pilot to carry the other channel) seemed to lend itself well to long-distance AM stereo, even NDXE was considering international SW stereo using the Kahn system...heck,I guess AM is just going to have to rely on superior programming,hi!