You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
Norm
:Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
:I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
:
:Hi blackbird
:
: You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
:
:http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
:
: It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
:
:Norm
:
::Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
::I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
::
Tuners have two sections that need to track in order to tune stations. Compare size and number of plates in different tuners.
An oscillator section must be smaller as it tunes the IF frequency above received signal. If it's not smaller a radio will have a padder cap.
A wrong tuner will work at the high end of the dial but gradually signals will get weaker as you tune lower.
That small cathode coil winding isn't critical just as long as it causes oscillation.
Norm
:It's the small outer winding. Here's another thing I did maybe this is the problem. I took out the old 80 tuning gang and put in a 84 gang which fits with longer bolts, since you have to use isolation dampers on the model 80. (the 84 gang is grounded to the chassis)
:maybe the chassis is not set up for the 84 tuning mechanism? any thoughts?
:Here's why I did it....
: I have an 84 cab. (painted red!! lol) & chassis which is junk, and an 80 chassis. The 84 tuning gang is in good shape. So I changed the tuning gangs since it enable the 80 chassis to fit perfectly in the 84 cab. perfect frankenradio for the shop! lol
:
:
::Hi blackbird
::
:: You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
::
::http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
::
:: It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
::
::Norm
::
:::Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
:::I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
:::
:Hi
:
: Tuners have two sections that need to track in order to tune stations. Compare size and number of plates in different tuners.
:
: An oscillator section must be smaller as it tunes the IF frequency above received signal. If it's not smaller a radio will have a padder cap.
:
: A wrong tuner will work at the high end of the dial but gradually signals will get weaker as you tune lower.
:
: That small cathode coil winding isn't critical just as long as it causes oscillation.
:
:Norm
:
:
:
::It's the small outer winding. Here's another thing I did maybe this is the problem. I took out the old 80 tuning gang and put in a 84 gang which fits with longer bolts, since you have to use isolation dampers on the model 80. (the 84 gang is grounded to the chassis)
::maybe the chassis is not set up for the 84 tuning mechanism? any thoughts?
::Here's why I did it....
:: I have an 84 cab. (painted red!! lol) & chassis which is junk, and an 80 chassis. The 84 tuning gang is in good shape. So I changed the tuning gangs since it enable the 80 chassis to fit perfectly in the 84 cab. perfect frankenradio for the shop! lol
::
::
:::Hi blackbird
:::
::: You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
:::
:::http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
:::
::: It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
:::
:::Norm
:::
::::Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
::::I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
::::
:Norm-
:Thanks!
:I just compared the two again...and sure enough the 84 has one gang smaller than the other, whereas the 80 has matching gangs. bummer! well I have to re-intall and go with plan b on that one. thanks!
:
::Hi
::
:: Tuners have two sections that need to track in order to tune stations. Compare size and number of plates in different tuners.
::
:: An oscillator section must be smaller as it tunes the IF frequency above received signal. If it's not smaller a radio will have a padder cap.
::
:: A wrong tuner will work at the high end of the dial but gradually signals will get weaker as you tune lower.
::
:: That small cathode coil winding isn't critical just as long as it causes oscillation.
::
::Norm
::
::
::
:::It's the small outer winding. Here's another thing I did maybe this is the problem. I took out the old 80 tuning gang and put in a 84 gang which fits with longer bolts, since you have to use isolation dampers on the model 80. (the 84 gang is grounded to the chassis)
:::maybe the chassis is not set up for the 84 tuning mechanism? any thoughts?
:::Here's why I did it....
::: I have an 84 cab. (painted red!! lol) & chassis which is junk, and an 80 chassis. The 84 tuning gang is in good shape. So I changed the tuning gangs since it enable the 80 chassis to fit perfectly in the 84 cab. perfect frankenradio for the shop! lol
:::
:::
::::Hi blackbird
::::
:::: You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
::::
::::http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
::::
:::: It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
::::
::::Norm
::::
:::::Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
:::::I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
:::::
You may want to check the throttle or regeneration control (18 on the diagram) adjustment. If I remember this adjustment is adjusted to just before the detector goes into oscllation. If anytime during tuning of the gang cap it tries to oscillate then back it off a bit.
Radiodoc
:well I changed the gang...and the same thing. Just some oscillation. I tried to use my eico on 'er to bring in to play, but the 2nd detector squeals when I pull the clip. when I hook the 324 to it, It still squeals. when I touch it it oscillates (with clip on).
:Voltages are pretty close.
:I know something is afoul, (I had another 80 I don't remember the squeal when I aligned) but I can't put a finger on it. Anybody have a clue?
:
:
::Norm-
::Thanks!
::I just compared the two again...and sure enough the 84 has one gang smaller than the other, whereas the 80 has matching gangs. bummer! well I have to re-intall and go with plan b on that one. thanks!
::
:::Hi
:::
::: Tuners have two sections that need to track in order to tune stations. Compare size and number of plates in different tuners.
:::
::: An oscillator section must be smaller as it tunes the IF frequency above received signal. If it's not smaller a radio will have a padder cap.
:::
::: A wrong tuner will work at the high end of the dial but gradually signals will get weaker as you tune lower.
:::
::: That small cathode coil winding isn't critical just as long as it causes oscillation.
:::
:::Norm
:::
:::
:::
::::It's the small outer winding. Here's another thing I did maybe this is the problem. I took out the old 80 tuning gang and put in a 84 gang which fits with longer bolts, since you have to use isolation dampers on the model 80. (the 84 gang is grounded to the chassis)
::::maybe the chassis is not set up for the 84 tuning mechanism? any thoughts?
::::Here's why I did it....
:::: I have an 84 cab. (painted red!! lol) & chassis which is junk, and an 80 chassis. The 84 tuning gang is in good shape. So I changed the tuning gangs since it enable the 80 chassis to fit perfectly in the 84 cab. perfect frankenradio for the shop! lol
::::
::::
:::::Hi blackbird
:::::
::::: You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
:::::
:::::http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
:::::
::::: It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
:::::
:::::Norm
:::::
::::::Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
::::::I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
::::::
:Blackbird,
:
:You may want to check the throttle or regeneration control (18 on the diagram) adjustment. If I remember this adjustment is adjusted to just before the detector goes into oscllation. If anytime during tuning of the gang cap it tries to oscillate then back it off a bit.
:
:Radiodoc
:
:
::well I changed the gang...and the same thing. Just some oscillation. I tried to use my eico on 'er to bring in to play, but the 2nd detector squeals when I pull the clip. when I hook the 324 to it, It still squeals. when I touch it it oscillates (with clip on).
::Voltages are pretty close.
::I know something is afoul, (I had another 80 I don't remember the squeal when I aligned) but I can't put a finger on it. Anybody have a clue?
::
::
:::Norm-
:::Thanks!
:::I just compared the two again...and sure enough the 84 has one gang smaller than the other, whereas the 80 has matching gangs. bummer! well I have to re-intall and go with plan b on that one. thanks!
:::
::::Hi
::::
:::: Tuners have two sections that need to track in order to tune stations. Compare size and number of plates in different tuners.
::::
:::: An oscillator section must be smaller as it tunes the IF frequency above received signal. If it's not smaller a radio will have a padder cap.
::::
:::: A wrong tuner will work at the high end of the dial but gradually signals will get weaker as you tune lower.
::::
:::: That small cathode coil winding isn't critical just as long as it causes oscillation.
::::
::::Norm
::::
::::
::::
:::::It's the small outer winding. Here's another thing I did maybe this is the problem. I took out the old 80 tuning gang and put in a 84 gang which fits with longer bolts, since you have to use isolation dampers on the model 80. (the 84 gang is grounded to the chassis)
:::::maybe the chassis is not set up for the 84 tuning mechanism? any thoughts?
:::::Here's why I did it....
::::: I have an 84 cab. (painted red!! lol) & chassis which is junk, and an 80 chassis. The 84 tuning gang is in good shape. So I changed the tuning gangs since it enable the 80 chassis to fit perfectly in the 84 cab. perfect frankenradio for the shop! lol
:::::
:::::
::::::Hi blackbird
::::::
:::::: You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
::::::
::::::http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
::::::
:::::: It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
::::::
::::::Norm
::::::
:::::::Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
:::::::I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
:::::::
And I suppose you tested/replaced the detector's grid resistor and capacitor. Possibly swap the first detector and second detector tubes.
Radiodoc
:Yeah I tried backing it off. I just lose the oscillation and the radio goes dead.
:I tried fwd too. same results.
:I have tried fooling with all the adjustments.
:
:
::Blackbird,
::
::You may want to check the throttle or regeneration control (18 on the diagram) adjustment. If I remember this adjustment is adjusted to just before the detector goes into oscllation. If anytime during tuning of the gang cap it tries to oscillate then back it off a bit.
::
::Radiodoc
::
::
:::well I changed the gang...and the same thing. Just some oscillation. I tried to use my eico on 'er to bring in to play, but the 2nd detector squeals when I pull the clip. when I hook the 324 to it, It still squeals. when I touch it it oscillates (with clip on).
:::Voltages are pretty close.
:::I know something is afoul, (I had another 80 I don't remember the squeal when I aligned) but I can't put a finger on it. Anybody have a clue?
:::
:::
::::Norm-
::::Thanks!
::::I just compared the two again...and sure enough the 84 has one gang smaller than the other, whereas the 80 has matching gangs. bummer! well I have to re-intall and go with plan b on that one. thanks!
::::
:::::Hi
:::::
::::: Tuners have two sections that need to track in order to tune stations. Compare size and number of plates in different tuners.
:::::
::::: An oscillator section must be smaller as it tunes the IF frequency above received signal. If it's not smaller a radio will have a padder cap.
:::::
::::: A wrong tuner will work at the high end of the dial but gradually signals will get weaker as you tune lower.
:::::
::::: That small cathode coil winding isn't critical just as long as it causes oscillation.
:::::
:::::Norm
:::::
:::::
:::::
::::::It's the small outer winding. Here's another thing I did maybe this is the problem. I took out the old 80 tuning gang and put in a 84 gang which fits with longer bolts, since you have to use isolation dampers on the model 80. (the 84 gang is grounded to the chassis)
::::::maybe the chassis is not set up for the 84 tuning mechanism? any thoughts?
::::::Here's why I did it....
:::::: I have an 84 cab. (painted red!! lol) & chassis which is junk, and an 80 chassis. The 84 tuning gang is in good shape. So I changed the tuning gangs since it enable the 80 chassis to fit perfectly in the 84 cab. perfect frankenradio for the shop! lol
::::::
::::::
:::::::Hi blackbird
:::::::
::::::: You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
:::::::
:::::::http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
:::::::
::::::: It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
:::::::
:::::::Norm
:::::::
::::::::Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
::::::::I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
::::::::
And I suppose you tested/replaced the detector's grid resistor and capacitor. Possibly swap the first detector and second detector tubes.
Radiodoc
:Yeah I tried backing it off. I just lose the oscillation and the radio goes dead.
:I tried fwd too. same results.
:I have tried fooling with all the adjustments.
:
:
::Blackbird,
::
::You may want to check the throttle or regeneration control (18 on the diagram) adjustment. If I remember this adjustment is adjusted to just before the detector goes into oscllation. If anytime during tuning of the gang cap it tries to oscillate then back it off a bit.
::
::Radiodoc
::
::
:::well I changed the gang...and the same thing. Just some oscillation. I tried to use my eico on 'er to bring in to play, but the 2nd detector squeals when I pull the clip. when I hook the 324 to it, It still squeals. when I touch it it oscillates (with clip on).
:::Voltages are pretty close.
:::I know something is afoul, (I had another 80 I don't remember the squeal when I aligned) but I can't put a finger on it. Anybody have a clue?
:::
:::
::::Norm-
::::Thanks!
::::I just compared the two again...and sure enough the 84 has one gang smaller than the other, whereas the 80 has matching gangs. bummer! well I have to re-intall and go with plan b on that one. thanks!
::::
:::::Hi
:::::
::::: Tuners have two sections that need to track in order to tune stations. Compare size and number of plates in different tuners.
:::::
::::: An oscillator section must be smaller as it tunes the IF frequency above received signal. If it's not smaller a radio will have a padder cap.
:::::
::::: A wrong tuner will work at the high end of the dial but gradually signals will get weaker as you tune lower.
:::::
::::: That small cathode coil winding isn't critical just as long as it causes oscillation.
:::::
:::::Norm
:::::
:::::
:::::
::::::It's the small outer winding. Here's another thing I did maybe this is the problem. I took out the old 80 tuning gang and put in a 84 gang which fits with longer bolts, since you have to use isolation dampers on the model 80. (the 84 gang is grounded to the chassis)
::::::maybe the chassis is not set up for the 84 tuning mechanism? any thoughts?
::::::Here's why I did it....
:::::: I have an 84 cab. (painted red!! lol) & chassis which is junk, and an 80 chassis. The 84 tuning gang is in good shape. So I changed the tuning gangs since it enable the 80 chassis to fit perfectly in the 84 cab. perfect frankenradio for the shop! lol
::::::
::::::
:::::::Hi blackbird
:::::::
::::::: You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
:::::::
:::::::http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
:::::::
::::::: It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
:::::::
:::::::Norm
:::::::
::::::::Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
::::::::I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
::::::::
:Blackbird,
:
:And I suppose you tested/replaced the detector's grid resistor and capacitor. Possibly swap the first detector and second detector tubes.
:
:Radiodoc
:
::Yeah I tried backing it off. I just lose the oscillation and the radio goes dead.
::I tried fwd too. same results.
::I have tried fooling with all the adjustments.
::
::
:::Blackbird,
:::
:::You may want to check the throttle or regeneration control (18 on the diagram) adjustment. If I remember this adjustment is adjusted to just before the detector goes into oscllation. If anytime during tuning of the gang cap it tries to oscillate then back it off a bit.
:::
:::Radiodoc
:::
:::
::::well I changed the gang...and the same thing. Just some oscillation. I tried to use my eico on 'er to bring in to play, but the 2nd detector squeals when I pull the clip. when I hook the 324 to it, It still squeals. when I touch it it oscillates (with clip on).
::::Voltages are pretty close.
::::I know something is afoul, (I had another 80 I don't remember the squeal when I aligned) but I can't put a finger on it. Anybody have a clue?
::::
::::
:::::Norm-
:::::Thanks!
:::::I just compared the two again...and sure enough the 84 has one gang smaller than the other, whereas the 80 has matching gangs. bummer! well I have to re-intall and go with plan b on that one. thanks!
:::::
::::::Hi
::::::
:::::: Tuners have two sections that need to track in order to tune stations. Compare size and number of plates in different tuners.
::::::
:::::: An oscillator section must be smaller as it tunes the IF frequency above received signal. If it's not smaller a radio will have a padder cap.
::::::
:::::: A wrong tuner will work at the high end of the dial but gradually signals will get weaker as you tune lower.
::::::
:::::: That small cathode coil winding isn't critical just as long as it causes oscillation.
::::::
::::::Norm
::::::
::::::
::::::
:::::::It's the small outer winding. Here's another thing I did maybe this is the problem. I took out the old 80 tuning gang and put in a 84 gang which fits with longer bolts, since you have to use isolation dampers on the model 80. (the 84 gang is grounded to the chassis)
:::::::maybe the chassis is not set up for the 84 tuning mechanism? any thoughts?
:::::::Here's why I did it....
::::::: I have an 84 cab. (painted red!! lol) & chassis which is junk, and an 80 chassis. The 84 tuning gang is in good shape. So I changed the tuning gangs since it enable the 80 chassis to fit perfectly in the 84 cab. perfect frankenradio for the shop! lol
:::::::
:::::::
::::::::Hi blackbird
::::::::
:::::::: You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
::::::::
::::::::http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
::::::::
:::::::: It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
::::::::
::::::::Norm
::::::::
:::::::::Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
:::::::::I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
:::::::::
The grid resistor I believe is around 4 megs. It may have increased in value. May have to test it out of the circuit if using a high impedance VOM.
Radiodoc
:i did all caps. my next though was the resistors though. I'll try the tube swap first.
:
:
::Blackbird,
::
::And I suppose you tested/replaced the detector's grid resistor and capacitor. Possibly swap the first detector and second detector tubes.
::
::Radiodoc
::
:::Yeah I tried backing it off. I just lose the oscillation and the radio goes dead.
:::I tried fwd too. same results.
:::I have tried fooling with all the adjustments.
:::
:::
::::Blackbird,
::::
::::You may want to check the throttle or regeneration control (18 on the diagram) adjustment. If I remember this adjustment is adjusted to just before the detector goes into oscllation. If anytime during tuning of the gang cap it tries to oscillate then back it off a bit.
::::
::::Radiodoc
::::
::::
:::::well I changed the gang...and the same thing. Just some oscillation. I tried to use my eico on 'er to bring in to play, but the 2nd detector squeals when I pull the clip. when I hook the 324 to it, It still squeals. when I touch it it oscillates (with clip on).
:::::Voltages are pretty close.
:::::I know something is afoul, (I had another 80 I don't remember the squeal when I aligned) but I can't put a finger on it. Anybody have a clue?
:::::
:::::
::::::Norm-
::::::Thanks!
::::::I just compared the two again...and sure enough the 84 has one gang smaller than the other, whereas the 80 has matching gangs. bummer! well I have to re-intall and go with plan b on that one. thanks!
::::::
:::::::Hi
:::::::
::::::: Tuners have two sections that need to track in order to tune stations. Compare size and number of plates in different tuners.
:::::::
::::::: An oscillator section must be smaller as it tunes the IF frequency above received signal. If it's not smaller a radio will have a padder cap.
:::::::
::::::: A wrong tuner will work at the high end of the dial but gradually signals will get weaker as you tune lower.
:::::::
::::::: That small cathode coil winding isn't critical just as long as it causes oscillation.
:::::::
:::::::Norm
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
::::::::It's the small outer winding. Here's another thing I did maybe this is the problem. I took out the old 80 tuning gang and put in a 84 gang which fits with longer bolts, since you have to use isolation dampers on the model 80. (the 84 gang is grounded to the chassis)
::::::::maybe the chassis is not set up for the 84 tuning mechanism? any thoughts?
::::::::Here's why I did it....
:::::::: I have an 84 cab. (painted red!! lol) & chassis which is junk, and an 80 chassis. The 84 tuning gang is in good shape. So I changed the tuning gangs since it enable the 80 chassis to fit perfectly in the 84 cab. perfect frankenradio for the shop! lol
::::::::
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:::::::::Hi blackbird
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::::::::: You did well getting the coil to oscillate. If it really is primary exact number of turns isn't critical. The tuned section of the coil is secondary which is critical.
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:::::::::http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/843/M0013843.pdf
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::::::::: It's common to have corrosion on Philco coils. PTOP, www.oldradio.parts.com has some original coils. Might find one for your Philco?
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:::::::::Norm
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::::::::::Ok so the primary winding was shot on one of my coils.
::::::::::I took off the tape covering it, and the wire was so bad that it just all fell out into a heaping mess. So bad I was unable to count the turns. I appoximated what was there with a 84 coil I had laying around. I used coil wire from a start relay from my junk box. (wire looked to be the same thickness) However the ohms rating is a lil bit off. Of course being the experimenter I am I put in in the chassis anyway. It now will oscillate, and pull one station at the 1400 end of the dial. (low volume) Anybody know how may turns I need to get the correct ohm rating? (I know ron rewinds these...but I wanna learn for my own knowledge):)
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As for the oscillator coil, the cathode coil was 8.4 ohms. That is significant in size. It must be rather large, too, because it appears that the cathode is modulated in this particular circuit, for oscillation (this changes grid bias reference, and is similar to modulating the grid, though not as strong).
Which coil did break? Was it the plate coil, the cathode coil, or the tuning condenser coil? The very small coil is the plate coil. The largest coil is the tuning condenser coil. The medium sized coil is the cathode coil.
The wire thickness should probably be in the high 30s, if not around 40 gauge. The wire in my Philco 60 is very thin. I assume that the wire in your coils is similar in size.
Thomas
::If you are working on the model 80, its condenser is connected directly to the chassis. All good radios have the condenser on dampers, regardless of where the condenser is connected, so that speaker vibrations don't make their way into the condenser, which would cause feedback due to frequency modulation (somewhat long explanation, but if you want it, just ask). You should replace the dampers in any case. Rubber washers of many kinds are available at your hardware store.
::
::As for the oscillator coil, the cathode coil was 8.4 ohms. That is significant in size. It must be rather large, too, because it appears that the cathode is modulated in this particular circuit, for oscillation (this changes grid bias reference, and is similar to modulating the grid, though not as strong).
::
::Which coil did break? Was it the plate coil, the cathode coil, or the tuning condenser coil? The very small coil is the plate coil. The largest coil is the tuning condenser coil. The medium sized coil is the cathode coil.
::
::The wire thickness should probably be in the high 30s, if not around 40 gauge. The wire in my Philco 60 is very thin. I assume that the wire in your coils is similar in size.
::
::Thomas
T.
:The tuning condenser of the model 80 may be on dampers, but it still IS connected to the chassis. You should not have to worry about it touching the chassis, because it SHOULD be connected to the chassis via a wire. If the condenser is not connected to the chassis with a wire, it won't function properly. Look at the model 80 schematic, and notice the chassis symbols for the tuning condenser segments. The condenser is in deed connected to the chassis. If you are not connecting the condenser to the chassis, this may very well be your problem as to why the set won't oscillate over the entire band.
:
:T.
:Interesting... I will double check that! I do see the two gangs going to ground on the schematic!! Thanks Thomas!
:
::The tuning condenser of the model 80 may be on dampers, but it still IS connected to the chassis. You should not have to worry about it touching the chassis, because it SHOULD be connected to the chassis via a wire. If the condenser is not connected to the chassis with a wire, it won't function properly. Look at the model 80 schematic, and notice the chassis symbols for the tuning condenser segments. The condenser is in deed connected to the chassis. If you are not connecting the condenser to the chassis, this may very well be your problem as to why the set won't oscillate over the entire band.
::
::T.
:never mind...it looks as if does go to # 8 as well.
:I'll have to look at the resistors....
::ok thomas, so here's is what I have now....
::The condeser gang has three wires...one is grounded. however the diagram shows #3 and # 4 both going to the 65 ohm side of coil #2.
::mine has #4 going to 2 and #3 going to the left lug on coil #8. Is that just a later change or is that connection wrong?
::
::
::
:::Interesting... I will double check that! I do see the two gangs going to ground on the schematic!! Thanks Thomas!
:::
::::The tuning condenser of the model 80 may be on dampers, but it still IS connected to the chassis. You should not have to worry about it touching the chassis, because it SHOULD be connected to the chassis via a wire. If the condenser is not connected to the chassis with a wire, it won't function properly. Look at the model 80 schematic, and notice the chassis symbols for the tuning condenser segments. The condenser is in deed connected to the chassis. If you are not connecting the condenser to the chassis, this may very well be your problem as to why the set won't oscillate over the entire band.
::::
::::T.
Linked both gangs together??????
Radiodoc
:so I reconnected exactly as the diagram...linking both gangs together...and I get oscillation across the dial now in the strong station areas...instead of just the high end. still can't quite get it to tune in.
:
::never mind...it looks as if does go to # 8 as well.
::I'll have to look at the resistors....
:::ok thomas, so here's is what I have now....
:::The condeser gang has three wires...one is grounded. however the diagram shows #3 and # 4 both going to the 65 ohm side of coil #2.
:::mine has #4 going to 2 and #3 going to the left lug on coil #8. Is that just a later change or is that connection wrong?
:::
:::
:::
::::Interesting... I will double check that! I do see the two gangs going to ground on the schematic!! Thanks Thomas!
::::
:::::The tuning condenser of the model 80 may be on dampers, but it still IS connected to the chassis. You should not have to worry about it touching the chassis, because it SHOULD be connected to the chassis via a wire. If the condenser is not connected to the chassis with a wire, it won't function properly. Look at the model 80 schematic, and notice the chassis symbols for the tuning condenser segments. The condenser is in deed connected to the chassis. If you are not connecting the condenser to the chassis, this may very well be your problem as to why the set won't oscillate over the entire band.
:::::
:::::T.
I just misunderstood what you were saying. I thought you meant that you connected both sections of the tuning gang together. I get ya now.
Radiodoc
:Look at #3 & #4 on the schematic. both grounded one side, other side to coil #2, 1st detector & coil #8. (the tuning condenser, if you don't like "tuning gang"
:) ;)
::Blackbird,
::
::Linked both gangs together??????
::
::Radiodoc
::
:::so I reconnected exactly as the diagram...linking both gangs together...and I get oscillation across the dial now in the strong station areas...instead of just the high end. still can't quite get it to tune in.
:::
::::never mind...it looks as if does go to # 8 as well.
::::I'll have to look at the resistors....
:::::ok thomas, so here's is what I have now....
:::::The condeser gang has three wires...one is grounded. however the diagram shows #3 and # 4 both going to the 65 ohm side of coil #2.
:::::mine has #4 going to 2 and #3 going to the left lug on coil #8. Is that just a later change or is that connection wrong?
:::::
:::::
:::::
::::::Interesting... I will double check that! I do see the two gangs going to ground on the schematic!! Thanks Thomas!
::::::
:::::::The tuning condenser of the model 80 may be on dampers, but it still IS connected to the chassis. You should not have to worry about it touching the chassis, because it SHOULD be connected to the chassis via a wire. If the condenser is not connected to the chassis with a wire, it won't function properly. Look at the model 80 schematic, and notice the chassis symbols for the tuning condenser segments. The condenser is in deed connected to the chassis. If you are not connecting the condenser to the chassis, this may very well be your problem as to why the set won't oscillate over the entire band.
:::::::
:::::::T.
Follow the schematic to a T. It is usually right.
Thomas
I believe 4 and 13 are the trimmers for the RF and OSC respectively and probably are mounted on the tuning cap.
Radiodoc
:Well, I'm not sure if I'm quite catching it. This is how it's supposed to be, and hopefully it's what you're saying: The frame of the condenser links the two rotors together automatically, so there's no need to manually link them together. It's connected to the chassis. Each stator is connected to a different coil, and they are NOT linked to one another. One stator goes to the antenna coil (ungrounded side, which goes to one of the grids in the oscillator), and the other stator goes to the 24 ohm winding in the oscillator coil. Notice, too, that this winding ONLY connects to the oscillator section of the tuning condenser, as well as the chassis, but does not electrically connect to any part of the oscillator tube. It is a magnetically coupled resonator circuit.
:
:Follow the schematic to a T. It is usually right.
:
:Thomas
:Blackbird,
:
:I believe 4 and 13 are the trimmers for the RF and OSC respectively and probably are mounted on the tuning cap.
:
:Radiodoc
:
::Well, I'm not sure if I'm quite catching it. This is how it's supposed to be, and hopefully it's what you're saying: The frame of the condenser links the two rotors together automatically, so there's no need to manually link them together. It's connected to the chassis. Each stator is connected to a different coil, and they are NOT linked to one another. One stator goes to the antenna coil (ungrounded side, which goes to one of the grids in the oscillator), and the other stator goes to the 24 ohm winding in the oscillator coil. Notice, too, that this winding ONLY connects to the oscillator section of the tuning condenser, as well as the chassis, but does not electrically connect to any part of the oscillator tube. It is a magnetically coupled resonator circuit.
::
::Follow the schematic to a T. It is usually right.
::
::Thomas
I looked that the service data on the 80. I couldn't tell for sure if the trimmers (4 & 13) were mounted on the gang tuning cap or mounted on the chassis (or bracket). I suppose if the two trimmers were mounted on the chassis there would be wires tying them to each respective section of the ganged tuning cap. The two sections of the tuning gang should not be jumpered together as one section tunes the RF transformer and the other section tunes the oscillator coil. On the pictorial of the 80 tuning gang, one of the adjustments is marked 3. I believe this adjustment
is 13 to correspond with the schematic.
Radiodoc
:I looked at an 84 schematic as well, but to me looks as if the rotors are coupled, but to me it doesn't make ANY sense either. (plus the original wiring dosn't support it either.) I just put a jumper on it, so I am going to take it off and tackle the resistors, double check cap connections and see how she goes.
:
:
::Blackbird,
::
::I believe 4 and 13 are the trimmers for the RF and OSC respectively and probably are mounted on the tuning cap.
::
::Radiodoc
::
:::Well, I'm not sure if I'm quite catching it. This is how it's supposed to be, and hopefully it's what you're saying: The frame of the condenser links the two rotors together automatically, so there's no need to manually link them together. It's connected to the chassis. Each stator is connected to a different coil, and they are NOT linked to one another. One stator goes to the antenna coil (ungrounded side, which goes to one of the grids in the oscillator), and the other stator goes to the 24 ohm winding in the oscillator coil. Notice, too, that this winding ONLY connects to the oscillator section of the tuning condenser, as well as the chassis, but does not electrically connect to any part of the oscillator tube. It is a magnetically coupled resonator circuit.
:::
:::Follow the schematic to a T. It is usually right.
:::
:::Thomas
The rotor (movable part) for the two sections of the tuning gang are mechanically ganged together and are at -B/ground/chassis connection thru the frame of the cap. The fixed sections are separated from each other and insulated from -B/ground/chassis.
Radiodoc
::I looked at an 84 schematic as well, but to me looks as if the rotors are coupled, but to me it doesn't make ANY sense either. (plus the original wiring dosn't support it either.) I just put a jumper on it, so I am going to take it off and tackle the resistors, double check cap connections and see how she goes.
::
::
:::Blackbird,
:::
:::I believe 4 and 13 are the trimmers for the RF and OSC respectively and probably are mounted on the tuning cap.
:::
:::Radiodoc
:::
::::Well, I'm not sure if I'm quite catching it. This is how it's supposed to be, and hopefully it's what you're saying: The frame of the condenser links the two rotors together automatically, so there's no need to manually link them together. It's connected to the chassis. Each stator is connected to a different coil, and they are NOT linked to one another. One stator goes to the antenna coil (ungrounded side, which goes to one of the grids in the oscillator), and the other stator goes to the 24 ohm winding in the oscillator coil. Notice, too, that this winding ONLY connects to the oscillator section of the tuning condenser, as well as the chassis, but does not electrically connect to any part of the oscillator tube. It is a magnetically coupled resonator circuit.
::::
::::Follow the schematic to a T. It is usually right.
::::
::::Thomas