I started this post a week or so ago here:

http://www.nostalgiaair.org/Forums/Messages/623/M0048623.htm

You can get all the previous info there, but I'm trying to get Edd's attention again. Here is the last part of my reply and current questions:

OK, I'm back! I tried hooking up the turntable and a CD player to the dedicated phono inputs, but as the original turntable is no longer available, there is no power going back to the tuner in phono mode. When I hook up the turntable to the tape inputs in tape mode there is no sound from the speakers. A CD player in the same inputs plays, but requires more volume from the loudness control to make the same level of volume as the tuner requires. As a perspective, if volume is 1 to 10, a level of 5 for the CD player is equivalent to 3 from the tuner. So here's my thought; once I get the appropriate preamp for the new turntable (still not sure on how to go about that) I think a simple A/B switch with the signal from the turntable through the preamp on one side (A) and the inputs from the CD player on the other (B) with the switch output plugged into the tape input, will get me the ability to play music from both external components. If this logic is sound, I need the following: 1. an appropriate preamp for the turntable. 2. an appropriate all RCA style A/B switch. 3. as needed RCA cables. I'll leave it here for now to see if you agree with my assumptions. Thanks, Randy

Any and all help appreciated. Thanks, Randy

http://cgi.ebay.com/Dynaco-preamp-PAT-4A-Vintage-stereo-preamplifier-Dyna_W0QQitemZ260101491326QQcategoryZ67807QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I have a tube version of this amplifier. The one above seems to be transistorized, since it says that there are no user servicable parts inside. If you have a consol, you could drop this unit down inside. Adjust the volume and then leave it there.

You can also build a small pre-amplifier using some 12AT7s, and various parts you can get at Radio Shack. You'll need tube sockets and 250 volt 47 mfd electrolytics, though, which can only be found at www.tubesandmore.com or www.radiodaze.com, or www.ebay.com

Thomas

Heeees baaaack….can you hear me now ?... can you hear me now ?

I'll just tack this reply onto your newly developed thread, of the same topic.

O.K. saw your comeback , but I’m still in the dark on the type of unit that you have, as to it being a verrry late bloomer tube set or an earlier solid state design. Need more numbers from the tuner cluster chassis inside or the amp assemblies.
First, you have not yet tried going into the actual phono input jacks, because your unit will not power up in that mode with it missing its standard turntable, with its all important remoted slave switch.
Lets attack that initially, since your replacement turntable unit is in all probability, just that, a mere turntable and not an automatic turntable with multiple play capabilities and that specific switched end of play function.

Given that you have already found that triple pin connector that fed the power to the TT with its three connections; you will be wanting to differentiate as to the two that feed….. HOT….120VAC to the old units phono motor and the other one that fed AC power back to keep your units electronics active when the unit was turned on to the phono made and had the TT playing its records.

Heres how to safely do it:
1…Get / make yourself a 100 watt incandescent test lamp (100 watt lamp screwed into a hardware
store pigtail leaded socket,outputted as wire leads…or …
2…Drop light with 100 watt “bub” and clip on test leads at the AC plugs spade terminals…either method, all appropriately temporarily taped up/insulated for your safety or them else getting into an improper touching condition and going off like Flash Gordon.
Now, here’s the drill, if you fire up the system and place it in the phono position and connect “le teste lampe” between a particular two of those connector terminals you will be getting a BRILLLLLANTE lamp lighting…..congrats, you just found the full AC voltage sourcing, destined for the old units Phono Motor.
The next situation would be there being no light at all, in which case you have have connected up between the AC ground and the switch function of the old turntable. That only leaves the last, all important, combination of the two connections where the lamp could light with a reduced level of brightness, as you are now series supplying voltage back to your sets electronics thru your lamp. Now, I’m a blind man, and can’t see your lamp, but that might be enough voltage /power passage to get your electronics/amp working in a quasi normal state
Or, if the lamp is about half brightness, the electronics may be starved and not fulfill the units testing of an input of the CD player into the phono input to compare its max audio level to that which you experienced while inputting into the tape input.
Should you have experienced about a half brightness of that lamp you could safely go confiscate mamacita’s pressing iron or toaster oven and use either of them in place of the lamp connect-up as described in the second option above.
That will assure proper / enough power feed thru to confirm proper operation of the system electronics.,as well, it will safely clinch the fact that those are the two exact wires that need to be jumpered together .
That being to to replicate the old TT switches function and get your electronics powering up anytime you switch it to its phono position.
Then you use a separate plugged in AC power for the replacement TT and the RCA connectors accept the piped in AF from the TT’s cartridge…CONSIDERING it is not using one of the.very low output, variable reluctance (“vewy”… “vewy” likely) cartridges, which would require
An offboard preamp to bring its level up to the systems designed phono input level.

Thassit for now

73’s de Edd

:Ok, I'm back in San Diego with test gear in hand! Hope your out there Edd! To answer your first question, it is an early solid state unit, not a tube in sight. According to the diagram pasted on the floor of the unit, there were 2 connections coming from the original turntable. One "wire" leaving the turntable travels to the tuner circuit board and plugs into a connection labeled "phono input". It has the same style 3 wire connector as the other "wire" listed on the diagram. This "wire" has the same type of wiring as the other output "wires" (tape & speakers)ie., the center of the 3 wires is an unshielded wire that runs into both of the outer 2 wires that end in RCA style jacks. I am considering these to be strictly left and right channel output cables that have nothing to do with powering anything. The other "wire" description shows a green and black wire leaving the turntable and going to the "phono pwr" connection on what the diagram calls the back of the tuner unit. This connector has 3 wires (the infamous triple pin connector from the last post). Why the diagram shows only 2 wires leaving the turntable I don't know as the connector it is destined to plug into has 3 wires and I don't have the original wire to look at. This is where I performed the "light bulb" test. The connector on the tuner housing has a pointed end on one side. The color of the wires from the pointy end to the blunt end are Purple, Orange, Grey. When connecting the 100W bulb to the Grey & Purple wires I get a fully illuminated bulb. The bulb turns on as soon as I power up the unit and stays on when the mode switch is turned to the phono mode. In fact it stays lit as long as the unit is powered on. For clarification, there is a seperate "on" switch with the word "timbre" on the face plate that controls the volume that is seperate from the mode switch. And that is the end of the results. No matter what other connectors are connected to the light bulb there are no other illuminations at all. Also, there is no time when the mode switch is turned to the phono mode when the tuner stays powered up. Even when the bulb is glowing bright it stays bright, but when the mode switch is turned to the phono mode the tuner turns off and the bulb stays lit. So it appears I have found the 120v power and ground (Purple and Grey) but have not found the wires necessary to jump to keep the tuner powered up in phono mode. Worthy of note but probably useless information is that there is a much more distinctive "click" when the mode switch is turned to the phono mode. I'm sure this is normal but thought I would mention it anyway as it is different than the others and I don't have another unit to compare it to. So why doesn't the tuner stay powered up in any test mode? Perhaps the mode switch is faulty? It would require removal of the tuner to do any testing on the mode switch as it is only partially visible in the installed position. I am contemplating directly jumping together the Orange and Grey wires to see if that keeps the tuner powered up, but will wait to see if I get a reply first. So that's all I have for now. I will be here for a couple of days so hope to hear back soon. Thanks, Randy
:Heeees baaaack….can you hear me now ?... can you hear me now ?
:
:I'll just tack this reply onto your newly developed thread, of the same topic.
:
:O.K. saw your comeback , but I’m still in the dark on the type of unit that you have, as to it being a verrry late bloomer tube set or an earlier solid state design. Need more numbers from the tuner cluster chassis inside or the amp assemblies.
:First, you have not yet tried going into the actual phono input jacks, because your unit will not power up in that mode with it missing its standard turntable, with its all important remoted slave switch.
:Lets attack that initially, since your replacement turntable unit is in all probability, just that, a mere turntable and not an automatic turntable with multiple play capabilities and that specific switched end of play function.
:
:Given that you have already found that triple pin connector that fed the power to the TT with its three connections; you will be wanting to differentiate as to the two that feed….. HOT….120VAC to the old units phono motor and the other one that fed AC power back to keep your units electronics active when the unit was turned on to the phono made and had the TT playing its records.
:
:Heres how to safely do it:
:1…Get / make yourself a 100 watt incandescent test lamp (100 watt lamp screwed into a hardware
:store pigtail leaded socket,outputted as wire leads…or …
:2…Drop light with 100 watt “bub” and clip on test leads at the AC plugs spade terminals…either method, all appropriately temporarily taped up/insulated for your safety or them else getting into an improper touching condition and going off like Flash Gordon.
:Now, here’s the drill, if you fire up the system and place it in the phono position and connect “le teste lampe” between a particular two of those connector terminals you will be getting a BRILLLLLANTE lamp lighting…..congrats, you just found the full AC voltage sourcing, destined for the old units Phono Motor.
:The next situation would be there being no light at all, in which case you have have connected up between the AC ground and the switch function of the old turntable. That only leaves the last, all important, combination of the two connections where the lamp could light with a reduced level of brightness, as you are now series supplying voltage back to your sets electronics thru your lamp. Now, I’m a blind man, and can’t see your lamp, but that might be enough voltage /power passage to get your electronics/amp working in a quasi normal state
:Or, if the lamp is about half brightness, the electronics may be starved and not fulfill the units testing of an input of the CD player into the phono input to compare its max audio level to that which you experienced while inputting into the tape input.
:Should you have experienced about a half brightness of that lamp you could safely go confiscate mamacita’s pressing iron or toaster oven and use either of them in place of the lamp connect-up as described in the second option above.
:That will assure proper / enough power feed thru to confirm proper operation of the system electronics.,as well, it will safely clinch the fact that those are the two exact wires that need to be jumpered together .
:That being to to replicate the old TT switches function and get your electronics powering up anytime you switch it to its phono position.
:Then you use a separate plugged in AC power for the replacement TT and the RCA connectors accept the piped in AF from the TT’s cartridge…CONSIDERING it is not using one of the.very low output, variable reluctance (“vewy”… “vewy” likely) cartridges, which would require
:An offboard preamp to bring its level up to the systems designed phono input level.
:
:Thassit for now
:
:73’s de Edd
:
:

*****So it appears I have found the 120v power and ground (Purple and Grey) but have not found the wires necessary to jump to keep the tuner powered up in phono mode. Worthy of note but probably useless information is that there is a much more distinctive "click" when the mode switch is turned to the phono mode. *******

What you are encountering is that the phono position is additionally engaging a heavier piggy backed separate switch function for the power to the phono motor AND possibly for the power loop back to the main amp also, when in that phono mode.

I am in agreement with your finding the Grey and Purple being your power sourcing to feed the phono motor...BUT... are you saying that with either the test lamp ( or mamacitas iron..series connected) and then connected between that orange wire and then trying the other completing connection being made to either that Grey or Purple will not have the main electronics then being powered up.... ??? Hmmmm.. then sounds that an inspection of that piggy back switch that I just mentioned might be in order...seems like it was a spdt function. Sooooo just seems that you need to pull the tuner cluster to confirm that and an ohmming out of its proper contact action when it is switched into phono mode and then out of that mode. In the meantime, if you will inspect and find allllll model number(s) or chassis numbers I might just come up with a schematic for that unit, and then all would be readily apparent.
Heyyy...with your forthcoming info so far, at least I now know that the unit is solidified state !

Waiting for all of the mystical and magical numbers.
73's de Edd

Since I believe that this has been split up into two different threads, I initiated a search on others that had queries on "Astrosonics" in hope of coming up with other model numbers that would research out.. and actually came up with your 1P3915 which was useless...but getting into a needle referencing guide I was able to zero in on a massive cache of other model numbers, one of which panned out.

Now in referring to my thumbnail schema reference with its GREEN shadow box referencing of some models not using the Molex connector and its wiring as shown....we then refer over to my Fuscia highlighted reference to the magical mystery switch being on the BASS control...as a pull out-push in snap action switch configuration. So that might just might be your answer, for the powering up of the amp, considering that it was not placed on another controls function ..such as your "timbre" control, soooooo check all of them them out.
I seem to be in error, in this schematic having one color coding of wire missing, BUT I certainly think that it is close enough to solve the wiring answer.

Refer to the boxes progressing numbering sequences in the routing of the AC low side in Black boxes and the AC hot side in Red boxes in its movement from the AC plug and thru the 6 pin molex connector on to the final connection to the power transformer of the unit.

****** The color of the wires "from the pointy end to the blunt end" are ******....
....HEY...any chance that you are any way related to my wifes aunt ??

Schema thumbnail reference:

http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/1222/astrosonicsteeeerosolidkk4.jpg

73's de Edd

:Since I believe that this has been split up into two different threads, I initiated a search on others that had queries on "Astrosonics" in hope of coming up with other model numbers that would research out.. and actually came up with your 1P3915 which was useless...but getting into a needle referencing guide I was able to zero in on a massive cache of other model numbers, one of which panned out.
:
:Now in referring to my thumbnail schema reference with its GREEN shadow box referencing of some models not using the Molex connector and its wiring as shown....we then refer over to my Fuscia highlighted reference to the magical mystery switch being on the BASS control...as a pull out-push in snap action switch configuration. So that might just might be your answer, for the powering up of the amp, considering that it was not placed on another controls function ..such as your "timbre" control, soooooo check all of them them out.
:I seem to be in error, in this schematic having one color coding of wire missing, BUT I certainly think that it is close enough to solve the wiring answer.
:
:Refer to the boxes progressing numbering sequences in the routing of the AC low side in Black boxes and the AC hot side in Red boxes in its movement from the AC plug and thru the 6 pin molex connector on to the final connection to the power transformer of the unit.
:
:
:****** The color of the wires "from the pointy end to the blunt end" are ******....
:....HEY...any chance that you are any way related to my wifes aunt ??
:
:Schema thumbnail reference:
:
:http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/1222/astrosonicsteeeerosolidkk4.jpg
:
:73's de Edd

I have had a look at this now and I'm pretty sure this is not the correct diagram. The BASS knob is strictly a 4 position switch. Additionally, the Molex connectors out of the amp and into the radio chassis are 12 pin types with 7 wires in them. It is difficult for me to make out any of the labeling on the "schema" aside from the numbers you put in, but it looks like the original record changer is shown below your green shadow box. If this is correct, then the diagram is much different than what my Maggotbox has. I have 7 wires leaving the amp in a 12 pin connector going to the radio chassis. From there they go up to the mode switch and then the 3 wires previously discussed(Grey, Orange & Purple)come out of the mode switch to the Phono Pwr 3 pin connector. I don't see a multiple mode position switch on the schema aside from the ones by the 7&8 red boxes that appear to be tone control, not mode control. Having looked at the ON/TIMBRE switch on my unit, I see 2 wires coming out of that switch. One Purple and one Blue. The Purple wire runs directly to the mode switch and from that same terminal it runs to the phono pwr connector, so as allready discovered, this is clearly the 120 VAC wire.
Ok now, brace yourself. I am going to try to describe what I see on the mode switch! I will concentrate on the Purple & Orange wires as they are what we need to figure out (I think?). Are you ready? The mode switch has 3 parts to it, one on top of the other, that are all white, plastic and circular. The lower most of the 3 has several wires and a capacitor soldered to it. As previously mentioned, the Purple wire from the ON/TIMBRE switch passes through one of these terminals to the 3 pin phono pwr connector. Next to that terminal is the Orange wire that goes to the 3 pin phono pwr connector. Now, above that are 2 of the white circular discs that are right on top of each other. The upper one has the Purple wire (and others) and the lower one has the Orange wire. Both of these come out of the circuit board (or into the circuit board) to (from) the mode switch. So I am assuming somewhere along the line the Orange wire has lost it's signal. Or maybe there is something else that is missing that eludes my (in)experience (which is vast in this realm!) I will stop here before I confuse (or disgrace!) things any more. Looking forward to hearing back from you! Thanks again, Randy

:Since I believe that this has been split up into two different threads, I initiated a search on others that had queries on "Astrosonics" in hope of coming up with other model numbers that would research out.. and actually came up with your 1P3915 which was useless...but getting into a needle referencing guide I was able to zero in on a massive cache of other model numbers, one of which panned out.
:
:Now in referring to my thumbnail schema reference with its GREEN shadow box referencing of some models not using the Molex connector and its wiring as shown....we then refer over to my Fuscia highlighted reference to the magical mystery switch being on the BASS control...as a pull out-push in snap action switch configuration. So that might just might be your answer, for the powering up of the amp, considering that it was not placed on another controls function ..such as your "timbre" control, soooooo check all of them them out.
:I seem to be in error, in this schematic having one color coding of wire missing, BUT I certainly think that it is close enough to solve the wiring answer.
:
:Refer to the boxes progressing numbering sequences in the routing of the AC low side in Black boxes and the AC hot side in Red boxes in its movement from the AC plug and thru the 6 pin molex connector on to the final connection to the power transformer of the unit.
:
:
:****** The color of the wires "from the pointy end to the blunt end" are ******....
:....HEY...any chance that you are any way related to my wifes aunt ??
:
:Schema thumbnail reference:
:
:http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/1222/astrosonicsteeeerosolidkk4.jpg
:
:73's de Edd

Ahh Edd, finally the mystical and magical numbers. Provided for your enjoyment the SAMS number is 1047-4. I was interested in hearing about those little paper labels too. One more elusive Magnavox Model number identified to technical data!

Bill VA

:*****So it appears I have found the 120v power and ground (Purple and Grey) but have not found the wires necessary to jump to keep the tuner powered up in phono mode. Worthy of note but probably useless information is that there is a much more distinctive "click" when the mode switch is turned to the phono mode. *******
:
:What you are encountering is that the phono position is additionally engaging a heavier piggy backed separate switch function for the power to the phono motor AND possibly for the power loop back to the main amp also, when in that phono mode.
:
:I am in agreement with your finding the Grey and Purple being your power sourcing to feed the phono motor...BUT... are you saying that with either the test lamp ( or mamacitas iron..series connected) and then connected between that orange wire and then trying the other completing connection being made to either that Grey or Purple will not have the main electronics then being powered up.... ??? Hmmmm.. then sounds that an inspection of that piggy back switch that I just mentioned might be in order...seems like it was a spdt function. Sooooo just seems that you need to pull the tuner cluster to confirm that and an ohmming out of its proper contact action when it is switched into phono mode and then out of that mode. In the meantime, if you will inspect and find allllll model number(s) or chassis numbers I might just come up with a schematic for that unit, and then all would be readily apparent.
:Heyyy...with your forthcoming info so far, at least I now know that the unit is solidified state !
:
:Waiting for all of the mystical and magical numbers.
:73's de Edd

Thanks again for your help. I will post all available numbers here before I attempt to digest your other post with the "schema". On the label attached to the furniture portion of the unit it shows the Model No. as 1P3915 with a Serial No. 1695948 made in Ft. Wayne, Indiana. Also on that label it says 120 Watts. Seems to me this label is more for the furniture than the unit as it has a space for the serial number of the TV installed, which this unit does not have. I found the brochure that came with this unit although the owners manual is lost and the brochure does not have this model number in it indicating to me that it was either an end of the year or beginning of the year model. But back to the numbers. The schematic pasted inside this unit shows a diagram number on the bottom of the sheet reading EL 2444-1. It is a wire routing diagram only and not a schematic proper. On the Amplifier section there are 2 labels that are just small stickers. One is attached to the circuit board that has the tuner input cable attached to it and reads 701236 5 5/68. The other sticker is attached to the top of a large blue component that is one of 2 that are about the size of a "D" cell battery. The circuit board below them designate them as C204 & C205, but I digress. That sticker reads A57602 AA 5/68. There is also a sticker on the radio chassis itself, but it is partially torn at the end of the number so the last 2 numbers may be incorrect. It reads R22301008A 6/68. The last 2 may be 04, 64, 6A, you get the idea. That's it for the numbers available. I have the feeling that this unit was one that was put together from left over parts in the warehouse at the end of the model year which is complicating our search for specific information. The brochure I mentioned doesn't list a 120 Watt unit but it does look like it is one step down from the top of the line at the time as it has 2 woofers and 2 "horns" as opposed to the top of the line having 4 each. Having had a good laugh at your comparison of my colorful description and your wife's relatives, I will say that the connectors are Molex type connectors. Both turntable connectors end in 3 pin Molex connectors, one for the output that runs to the radio chassis and one that runs to the phono power connection on the radio back. I am here for another day and did not bring my DVOM so I will spend the rest of the night trying to get to grips with the "schema" you posted and see if it coinsides with the electrics I have here. Additionally, there are 6 control knobs on the face plate. The top is the mode switch with 5 positions. AM, FM, FM-AFC, TAPE & ST PH.
Next is the ON-OFF switch which is also labeled TIMBRE. Next is a 4 position TREBLE knob then one labeled LOUDNESS which operates as the volume control. Next is the 4 position BASS knob and finally is the TUNING knob. The TIMBRE knob seems to act like a "tone" control like old car radios had (remember?) in that it seems to add brightness to all ranges. Ok, that's it for now! Good luck! I'll get back once I make sense of the "schema"! Thanks again, Randy

Aaah Yes, the right honourable and esteemed Sir William from the great commonwealth of Vir-gi-ni-A. With that info from those yellowed cardboard tabs, I also was able to zero in on the specific unit at hand. And Randy...Dandy... the info that you certainly want to file for positive identification for your / dads unit in the future is:

The power supply amp unit:
A57602 AA (circa 5/68......May 1968)

The tuning unit:
R22301 AA / DC or EC are valid series numbers for the last alfa / digits [that you could not discern] (circa 6/68....June 1968)

So here are three references to the inteconnects via the Molex connectors as well as Ref 4 gives a close up of the reason there is that extra oomph required to switch into the phono position. As mentioned, it is the switch at the end of the green indicator arrow and highly magnified, such that you can see the jumper / buss wire that connects two terminals to enact its SPDT function.
Since you initiated the auto radio comment, this was the type of troublesome switch encountered in ohhhh so many old car radios.
One pic had a lot of audio wiring associated with speaker and headphone wiring, so I have yellowed that non pertinent info out. The only thing that I was noticing in on that area was the fact the unit uses 8 large TO-3 cased output transistors to feed two large Quam-Nichols 15 in spkrs with
3 X 9 mid range horns. Shake...Shake.....SHAKE... your money maker!

Tech References:

http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/8948/magnavoxpwrsupplylv4.jpg
http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/6384/magnavoxwireroutingqb4.jpg
http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/2325/powermolexconnectionsly4.jpg
http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/6316/spdtphonoswitchlv7.jpg

Ref One and Three are the ones to confirm as to whether your main units power switch is a rocker style switch a shown in the first reference.
Orrrr....the Third reference has the main power switch being on the rear of the "timbre" switch..and that's you...isn't it ?
As far as the phono jumper function that would be the phono Molex with a jumper between the delta keyed end and the center pin connection.

Thassit..now you just have to take on the the phono pre-amp or cartridge situation.

73's de Edd

:Aaah Yes, the right honourable and esteemed Sir William from the great commonwealth of Vir-gi-ni-A. With that info from those yellowed cardboard tabs, I also was able to zero in on the specific unit at hand. And Randy...Dandy... the info that you certainly want to file for positive identification for your / dads unit in the future is:
:
:The power supply amp unit:
:A57602 AA (circa 5/68......May 1968)
:
:The tuning unit:
:R22301 AA / DC or EC are valid series numbers for the last alfa / digits [that you could not discern] (circa 6/68....June 1968)
:
:So here are three references to the inteconnects via the Molex connectors as well as Ref 4 gives a close up of the reason there is that extra oomph required to switch into the phono position. As mentioned, it is the switch at the end of the green indicator arrow and highly magnified, such that you can see the jumper / buss wire that connects two terminals to enact its SPDT function.
:Since you initiated the auto radio comment, this was the type of troublesome switch encountered in ohhhh so many old car radios.
:One pic had a lot of audio wiring associated with speaker and headphone wiring, so I have yellowed that non pertinent info out. The only thing that I was noticing in on that area was the fact the unit uses 8 large TO-3 cased output transistors to feed two large Quam-Nichols 15 in spkrs with
:3 X 9 mid range horns. Shake...Shake.....SHAKE... your money maker!
:
:Tech References:
:
:http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/8948/magnavoxpwrsupplylv4.jpg
:http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/6384/magnavoxwireroutingqb4.jpg
:http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/2325/powermolexconnectionsly4.jpg
:http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/6316/spdtphonoswitchlv7.jpg
:
:Ref One and Three are the ones to confirm as to whether your main units power switch is a rocker style switch a shown in the first reference.
:Orrrr....the Third reference has the main power switch being on the rear of the "timbre" switch..and that's you...isn't it ?
:As far as the phono jumper function that would be the phono Molex with a jumper between the delta keyed end and the center pin connection.
:
:Thassit..now you just have to take on the the phono pre-amp or cartridge situation.
:
:73's de Edd
:
:Yes, yes, YES!!! Tuner section powers up in Phono mode with the Orange & Purple wires jumped! Thank you!
The "powermolex" diagram looks like the right one. Also, the picture of the SPDT switch is correct. The description you gave of the speakers seem very acurate as well. There are 2 15" speakers on either side and 2 3x9 horns facing out the front.
I have 2 turntables to choose from, one a Fisher MT-100 the other a Realistic(?!) LAB-89. Both play and make music and both play slow and with a lot of "wow" (speed variation). I tried both the internal power plug at the amp and a wall socket to make sure the speed problem wasn't from a lack of voltage or something from the internal power source and they paly the same no matter where they are plugged in. So hopefully they both have the same symptom because they are both old and have sat around unused for many years. I will be using the Realistic turntable as the volume from it matches in proportion the volume from the tuner and the Fisher is very quiet and would need some form of preamp. So whatever type of cartridge and electronics the Realistic has seems to match the original turntable. I will take the LAB-89 home with me and see about getting a new motor or whatever to get it to run at the correct speed. My father-in-law is thrilled just to have his old stereo working and since all his LP's are in poor condition or worse, I will not worry too much about the quality of the turntable. He bought the Realistic one a long time ago as a replacement when the original Micromatic failed in the first place, so there will be some value in it for him to get that one working. Sometimes it better to accept different takes on reality. Anyway, thanks again Edd and William for your time, patience and help on this success story. Together we have brought a little joy into an old Marines life!

******I will take the LAB-89 home with me and see about getting a new motor or whatever to get it to run at the correct speed. *********

Probably just a hardening of the drive rubber /idler(s) and a gumming up of the old lube on the motor shaft /porous bearings of the motor proper from a lack of lube in their surround felt washer reservoirs.
A teardown of the motor proper and degreasing, inspection of the shaft surfaces, hopefully not being damaged, and a re-lube and re assembly. Along with a like binding of the changer mechanics with its heavy grease...if this happens to be an auto changer, vice a common one play turntable.

Edd

: ******I will take the LAB-89 home with me and see about getting a new motor or whatever to get it to run at the correct speed. *********
:
:Probably just a hardening of the drive rubber /idler(s) and a gumming up of the old lube on the motor shaft /porous bearings of the motor proper from a lack of lube in their surround felt washer reservoirs.
:A teardown of the motor proper and degreasing, inspection of the shaft surfaces, hopefully not being damaged, and a re-lube and re assembly. Along with a like binding of the changer mechanics with its heavy grease...if this happens to be an auto changer, vice a common one play turntable.
:
:Edd
:
:I've done an initial inspection of the LAB-89. After removing the platter, I see a belt that is intact but seems somewhat brittle. I have a local source and will get a new one. The platter has what looks like a bronze bushing in it's center that rides on the shaft that doubles as the record holder. Yes it has an auto changer mechanism and when I ran the motor the other day it all worked as designed. That potion fo the turntable looks fine although I am sure a relube would be beneficial. There is a dark grey lube on the shaft that is still viscous but has accumulated to a couple of clumps. The platter spins very freely on the shaft as there is still some viable lube on the bearing/bushing surfaces. I see no residue or build up on the belt surface of the platter. The motor spindle looks clean as well and I see no other idler mechanism to be causing any resistance. I am short the necessary #1 Pillips screwdriver to remove the motor tonight so I will bring one home tomorrow as to not damage the hold down screws. I can see where the motor spindle goes into the motor and do not see a simple way to disassemble the motor. When I run the motor by itself it makes a rather loud repetitious thumping noise. Maybe an armature or internal bearing problem or perhaps a lube problem as suggested. There are all kinds of numbers on the motor so I may have enough info to get a replacement. I will wait to see what I can see when I remove the motor and to here back from this post. Thanks, Randy
:

I'm a little fuzzy on remembering that Lab series of RS but sort of thought that it was in reality, a newer Garrard under its covers.
Also you can fill me in on this..the number of speeds and what they are. Also the "Automatic" turntable aspect; in olden
times that meant the loading of up to 6-8 LP's on its 1/4 in center drop spindle and the unit then playing them all and
mechanically / electrically cutting off at the end of the last record.
In the last of the days the term automatic tt meant that the unit would accept one record on the stubby center spindle
and the arm would lift up at the end of that records playing and start a replay on that single record.... ad infinitum.

***** There is a dark grey lube on the shaft that is still viscous but has accumulated to a couple of clumps. *****
Needs all trace of that removed with a strong degreaser and re-lubed.

Possibly could this belt mentioned be a 12-15 in X .060 X 1/4 - 3/8 in wide belt that is strung up between a recessed,
slightly smaller inner diameter portion of the larger turntable platter and that belt is around the periphery of that
portion of the bottom of the TT and loops over a small dual diameter brass pulley on the motor shaft end. the idea being
that surely this unit does not have the old 78 speed or the old talking book 162/3 rpm capabilities. Leaving but only
two speeds needed 33 1/3 and 45's. Therefore, there is a half loop lever that is tied to the speed control knob and
that belt...while in movement... is flopped either up or down to the respective different diameters of collars on the
motor shaft when shifting speeds.
Since it is not an extremely old unit I am not expecting it to have utilized idler rubber tired wheels and a mechanically
transposed sets of intermediate idlers for speed changing. If that was used, usually the unit sets inactive for eons and
the pressure of the motor shaft to an idler or to the inside of the tt platter develops a flat and thus your repetetive
thumpa- thumpa noise that you mentioned until you replace the eccentric part at fault.

On a motor teardown, expect the botom of the motor shaft to be readily accessible , but the top is restrained from total
dissassembly by that press on multi diameter speed collar. BUT you can clean and work on it 1/2 at a time by sliding the
shaft to its extreme for partial access and confirm no gum or varnish...no hopefully no motor shaft galling or radial
scoring. Then degrease well and re lube and check the adjunct thick porous felt pads that suround the porous bronze
bushings that the motor shafts run in. The clamping action of the swedged in plates on the ends surrounding the bushings
almost keep them from being seen , but they are hiding in ther and certainly, dry as a bone, from wicking all of their
initial charge of oil into the top and bottom bushings.
I somehow feel that you will be successful in getting the unit all operational again, and not requiring a motor.
An inspection and trial will tell all.

73's de Edd

:I'm a little fuzzy on remembering that Lab series of RS but sort of thought that it was in reality, a newer Garrard under its covers.
:Also you can fill me in on this..the number of speeds and what they are. Also the "Automatic" turntable aspect; in olden
:times that meant the loading of up to 6-8 LP's on its 1/4 in center drop spindle and the unit then playing them all and
:mechanically / electrically cutting off at the end of the last record.
:In the last of the days the term automatic tt meant that the unit would accept one record on the stubby center spindle
:and the arm would lift up at the end of that records playing and start a replay on that single record.... ad infinitum.
:
:***** There is a dark grey lube on the shaft that is still viscous but has accumulated to a couple of clumps. *****
:Needs all trace of that removed with a strong degreaser and re-lubed.
:
:Possibly could this belt mentioned be a 12-15 in X .060 X 1/4 - 3/8 in wide belt that is strung up between a recessed,
:slightly smaller inner diameter portion of the larger turntable platter and that belt is around the periphery of that
:portion of the bottom of the TT and loops over a small dual diameter brass pulley on the motor shaft end. the idea being
:that surely this unit does not have the old 78 speed or the old talking book 162/3 rpm capabilities. Leaving but only
:two speeds needed 33 1/3 and 45's. Therefore, there is a half loop lever that is tied to the speed control knob and
:that belt...while in movement... is flopped either up or down to the respective different diameters of collars on the
:motor shaft when shifting speeds.
:Since it is not an extremely old unit I am not expecting it to have utilized idler rubber tired wheels and a mechanically
:transposed sets of intermediate idlers for speed changing. If that was used, usually the unit sets inactive for eons and
:the pressure of the motor shaft to an idler or to the inside of the tt platter develops a flat and thus your repetetive
:thumpa- thumpa noise that you mentioned until you replace the eccentric part at fault.
:
:On a motor teardown, expect the botom of the motor shaft to be readily accessible , but the top is restrained from total
:dissassembly by that press on multi diameter speed collar. BUT you can clean and work on it 1/2 at a time by sliding the
:shaft to its extreme for partial access and confirm no gum or varnish...no hopefully no motor shaft galling or radial
:scoring. Then degrease well and re lube and check the adjunct thick porous felt pads that suround the porous bronze
:bushings that the motor shafts run in. The clamping action of the swedged in plates on the ends surrounding the bushings
:almost keep them from being seen , but they are hiding in ther and certainly, dry as a bone, from wicking all of their
:initial charge of oil into the top and bottom bushings.
:I somehow feel that you will be successful in getting the unit all operational again, and not requiring a motor.
:An inspection and trial will tell all.
:
:73's de Edd
:
A few more details - the plate under the tonearm has "BSR" on it. The stickers on the cabinet, base & platter say "Wei Hsiang Denki HI-RQ" with an additional red sticker on the base that reads "Capetronic Taiwan". Not too sophisticated I'm afraid. It is an auto-changer in the style that has the capability to stack several records onto the tall center spindle and drop them down one at a time. It is a 2 speed model (33 1/3 & 45) with the belt changer mechanism exactly as you described.

The motor is a Matsushita 12VDC MMI-6S2R2A dated June 7, 1988. There are 6 threaded holes on the top surface where the brass spindle enters the motor housing. I can see screws in them and thought that if I could get the bottom cover off I would be able to disassemble the unit. However, I see no sign of a way into the underside of the motor. The outer housing does not seem to be swagged to the bottom cover but either pressed or sealed in some other fashion I'm not familiar with. I'm off to start more pressing Saturday projects and will do an internet search on the motor later today. Thanks, Randy