hi fellers,i kinda new at this but have some experience. in a big lot of radios i purchased [60]there were a few 'later' model tubers with circuit boards,i'm not having much luck removing caps without damaging the runners.any suggestions? i've done alot of point to point chassis and don't much like the boards but i have 'em so i gotta fix 'em,right?all help appreciated,thanks,phil

Are you using a de-soldering pump?

I always use one... they are great.
I have a "Soldapullit" brand..
Edsyn SOLDAPULLT
Edsyn Model DS017 $21.53
http://www.minute-man.com/acatalog/Edsyn_Desoldiring_Tools.html
.. very nice but not cheap..

However I saw the exact clone of it...at: Electronix.com for $3.99
So Here it is at a great price:
http://www.electronix.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/18/products_id/9205

:Are you using a de-soldering pump?
:
:I always use one... they are great.
:I have a "Soldapullit" brand..
:Edsyn SOLDAPULLT
:Edsyn Model DS017 $21.53
:http://www.minute-man.com/acatalog/Edsyn_Desoldiring_Tools.html
:.. very nice but not cheap..
:
: However I saw the exact clone of it...at: Electronix.com for $3.99
:So Here it is at a great price:
:http://www.electronix.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/18/products_id/9205

Buy the Chinese clone, you will get exactly what you pay for, junk.

Dave

Hi Dave:
.. Have you tried that one?
.. or is it just your somewhat pessimistic spectulaton based on the logic of "buy cheap get cheap"?

Dave:
The reason I ask is that although you make a good point of "getting what you pay for"...it's been my personal experience with this $3.99 solder sucker that it works as well as my $22 Edysn Soldapullit brand...
(empirically speaking)
In fact it is such a perfect clone that all the parts not only look identical.. they are perfectly interchangeable too!
Now maybe over time I'll find that the rubber O-ring inside may be of a lesser grade rubber... but so far all seems fine to me.
I Bought this cheaper unit because after months of use with the Edysn brand unit the tip kept popping off when it got clogged and I had to duct-tape it on.
So I didn't want to have to spend another $22 just to have a good back up unit. I figured for $3.99 this one was worth a try.
.. like I siad.. so far so good.

:Dave:
:The reason I ask is that although you make a good point of "getting what you pay for"...it's been my personal experience with this $3.99 solder sucker that it works as well as my $22 Edysn Soldapullit brand...
:(empirically speaking)
:In fact it is such a perfect clone that all the parts not only look identical.. they are perfectly interchangeable too!
:Now maybe over time I'll find that the rubber O-ring inside may be of a lesser grade rubber... but so far all seems fine to me.
:I Bought this cheaper unit because after months of use with the Edysn brand unit the tip kept popping off when it got clogged and I had to duct-tape it on.
:So I didn't want to have to spend another $22 just to have a good back up unit. I figured for $3.99 this one was worth a try.
:.. like I siad.. so far so good.

thanks peter for the help,never even heard of one,i looked at the link you sent,GREAT SITE!. their cap prices look good also,have you tried them on other products? i'm also in need of 2 8in. round speakers,just plain old speakers like old bookshelve speakers we all had in the '70's. i need them to replace the o.e. in 2 philco 211 speakers. they are for the model 511 radio. with the p.m. speaker i'll also need matching trans ,still looking for those,2-4k input,4 or 8 secondary.if you know where i might find some let me know,i tried radio shack,wal-mart,everyone has 4-ways,three-ways,won't fit don't need them,thanks,phil

I take it that you are talking about the 511 radio shown on this web site. The Philco 511 originally used a high impedance magnetic type speaker (with the horse shoe permanent magnet). www.tubesandmore.com and www.radiodaze.com sell nice 8 inch speakers that will work well. They also sell nice output transformers. Another trick you might want to try (for better audio quality and more bass) is to place your output transformer primary in place of the choke on the plate of the output tube. Remove the choke and connect the output transformer primary exactly as the choke was connected. Don't worry about that condenser that originally fed the speaker. Just leave it disconnected. Choose a primary impedance that yields good power and tonal quality, as well as proper voltage at the output plate with no signal present.

Thomas

The outer braid on coax if stripped and flattened makes a good replacement for solderwik, if you have some old coax laying around. The more expensive stuff if silver plated is even better. Dip it in flux and it works even better. A small syringe with a teflon tip is equivalent to most solder suckers, and will even blow if the need arises. I have all the normal tools, but sometimes all it takes is "good old American ingenuity"

marv

:Dave:
:The reason I ask is that although you make a good point of "getting what you pay for"...it's been my personal experience with this $3.99 solder sucker that it works as well as my $22 Edysn Soldapullit brand...
:(empirically speaking)
:In fact it is such a perfect clone that all the parts not only look identical.. they are perfectly interchangeable too!
:Now maybe over time I'll find that the rubber O-ring inside may be of a lesser grade rubber... but so far all seems fine to me.
:I Bought this cheaper unit because after months of use with the Edysn brand unit the tip kept popping off when it got clogged and I had to duct-tape it on.
:So I didn't want to have to spend another $22 just to have a good back up unit. I figured for $3.99 this one was worth a try.
:.. like I siad.. so far so good.

:Hi Dave:
:.. Have you tried that one?
:.. or is it just your somewhat pessimistic spectulaton based on the logic of "buy cheap get cheap"?
_____________________________________________________

Peter

These are rather poor quality, tips melt and they seem to jam a lot, not even close to the real thing. Pessimistic, I don't think so, I do beleive in having quality tools to do a good job.

Dave

Well great Dave.. that's what I was asking.
.. so you HAVE actually been using this unit?
... and you found the the "teflon"? tip melts?
and clogs?
.. Well that's good to hear that you were basing it on having used this unit.

My Edsyn-Soldapullit $22 unit w/Teflon tip also 'sort-of' looks like it melts or something too...but not really 'melting' just sort of fraying and distorting-like.. y'know?
And it's always clogging too...

But I expect the clogging on both units though ...as the clogging only seems to happen if I'm sucking up a really big glob of solder here and there.
... It sucks it in there fine.. just has a hard time pushing it back out again after it hardened when cooled inside the chamber.
I too believe in quiality tools.. buy 'em once..that's all you'll need.
But..It's been my actual in-use experince with this thing that it's worked fine for me.

:Well great Dave.. that's what I was asking.
:.. so you HAVE actually been using this unit?
:... and you found the the "teflon"? tip melts?
:and clogs?
:.. Well that's good to hear that you were basing it on having used this unit.
:
:My Edsyn-Soldapullit $22 unit w/Teflon tip also 'sort-of' looks like it melts or something too...but not really 'melting' just sort of fraying and distorting-like.. y'know?
:And it's always clogging too...
:
:But I expect the clogging on both units though ...as the clogging only seems to happen if I'm sucking up a really big glob of solder here and there.
:... It sucks it in there fine.. just has a hard time pushing it back out again after it hardened when cooled inside the chamber.
:I too believe in quiality tools.. buy 'em once..that's all you'll need.
:But..It's been my actual in-use experince with this thing that it's worked fine for me.
:
:

thanks again peter for the site. i've ordered the solder sucker and about 20 of the caps i need,some flux and some cleaner,i'll let you know how it works,phil

In addition to a good solder sucker, consider getting a quality temperature controlled solder station. Pencil irons just don't cut it if you are going to do any repair work. Most of the cheapy irons cannot maintain temperature. They make it difficult to totally remove the solder and you end up heating the joint too long and burn up the circuit traces. Also you end up putting too much mechanical stress on the component and the circuit board. Weller is the brand I use but expect to pay at least $75 to get into a fair iron. Once you get one you won't go back to the pencil type and the quality of your soldering will improve. Also solder wick and liquid rosin flux used in conjunction with a solder sucker works wonders.

MRO

:hi fellers,i kinda new at this but have some experience. in a big lot of radios i purchased [60]there were a few 'later' model tubers with circuit boards,i'm not having much luck removing caps without damaging the runners.any suggestions? i've done alot of point to point chassis and don't much like the boards but i have 'em so i gotta fix 'em,right?all help appreciated,thanks,phil

:In addition to a good solder sucker, consider getting a quality temperature controlled solder station. Pencil irons just don't cut it if you are going to do any repair work. Most of the cheapy irons cannot maintain temperature. They make it difficult to totally remove the solder and you end up heating the joint too long and burn up the circuit traces. Also you end up putting too much mechanical stress on the component and the circuit board. Weller is the brand I use but expect to pay at least $75 to get into a fair iron. Once you get one you won't go back to the pencil type and the quality of your soldering will improve. Also solder wick and liquid rosin flux used in conjunction with a solder sucker works wonders.
:
:MRO
:
::hi fellers,i kinda new at this but have some experience. in a big lot of radios i purchased [60]there were a few 'later' model tubers with circuit boards,i'm not having much luck removing caps without damaging the runners.any suggestions? i've done alot of point to point chassis and don't much like the boards but i have 'em so i gotta fix 'em,right?all help appreciated,thanks,phil

I have about forty years experience at soldering on printed circuit boards. One solder sucker is just about as good as another. Some have ceramic tips and some have plastic tips but they all do about the same. Your problem seems to be too much heat. If you overheat the joint you will delaminate the printed trace from the phenolic board. My advice is get a "princess" style soldering Iron, keep the tip squeeky clean and well tinned. Only heat the joint until the solder connection melts and then quickly remove the lead. You can come back later and use your solder sucker to clean out the hole for the new lead. Always be careful to not overheat the board.

Will

::In addition to a good solder sucker, consider getting a quality temperature controlled solder station. Pencil irons just don't cut it if you are going to do any repair work. Most of the cheapy irons cannot maintain temperature. They make it difficult to totally remove the solder and you end up heating the joint too long and burn up the circuit traces. Also you end up putting too much mechanical stress on the component and the circuit board. Weller is the brand I use but expect to pay at least $75 to get into a fair iron. Once you get one you won't go back to the pencil type and the quality of your soldering will improve. Also solder wick and liquid rosin flux used in conjunction with a solder sucker works wonders.
::
::MRO
::
:::hi fellers,i kinda new at this but have some experience. in a big lot of radios i purchased [60]there were a few 'later' model tubers with circuit boards,i'm not having much luck removing caps without damaging the runners.any suggestions? i've done alot of point to point chassis and don't much like the boards but i have 'em so i gotta fix 'em,right?all help appreciated,thanks,phil
:
:I have about forty years experience at soldering on printed circuit boards. One solder sucker is just about as good as another. Some have ceramic tips and some have plastic tips but they all do about the same. Your problem seems to be too much heat. If you overheat the joint you will delaminate the printed trace from the phenolic board. My advice is get a "princess" style soldering Iron, keep the tip squeeky clean and well tinned. Only heat the joint until the solder connection melts and then quickly remove the lead. You can come back later and use your solder sucker to clean out the hole for the new lead. Always be careful to not overheat the board.
:
:Will

thanks will,thats probably what it is,i'm a newby so i'm learning,thanks to all,phil

What the heck is a "princess" style iron?

I have the weller SP23L 25watt pencil iron and the radio shack pencil iron too.
I really like the weller. The problem I sem to have is that the tips keep rotting away.
I use the Weller brand chisel tip.
MT3 - Chisel Tip 1/8" (SP23)
These tips are about 2 or $3 each!
As soon as I put a new tip in I tin it.
I'm usin radio Shack's rosin solder paste.

How can I keep these tips from deterioating so fast??

I use the Iron.. or leave it on maybe 4 - 5 hours every other day or so.
But these tips start rotting away after a week or two.
Would this happen with a controled temp station?

BTW:
Due to loss of mostly all fingers on my right hand I have very limited grasping ability with my right hand so I can only pinch/hold/grasp the pencil iron by the flat cord at the top and let it rest against the palm area.
Anyway that's why I kinda need a pencil shaped iron.
But I hate going through so many tips.
Any ideas?

If I remember correctly, Princess is a model by Weller that has a temperature controlled base unit with a small pencil like iron. It is very handy for fine circuit board work. I don't know the model number of my Weller but it has a temperature controlled (700 degrees) base unit with a standard size iron. I think the tip I use sets the temperature. I have a variety of tips which allow me to do circuit board work or solder chasis lugs. My tips have lasted years. I am not sure what the alloy they use is but they are not the standard copper ones used in pencil type irons. I know there are longer lasting alloy type ones available for many pencil types, but they don't seem to last as long as the ones for the temperature contolled units. When I install a new tip I tin it first and let it set for several minutes. I wipe it off and tin it again. Then it is ready for use. I keep it tinned. I have had many different types of irons. I have had the pencil type and have seen the tips rot away (copper or long lasting). The temp controlled units and their tips cost more but they pay for themselves in the long run. Check on the type of flux you are using. RA flux is more agressive that RMA flux (rosin activated, rosin mildly activated). I have used both types though with no problem.

MRO

:What the heck is a "princess" style iron?
:
:I have the weller SP23L 25watt pencil iron and the radio shack pencil iron too.
:I really like the weller. The problem I sem to have is that the tips keep rotting away.
:I use the Weller brand chisel tip.
:MT3 - Chisel Tip 1/8" (SP23)
:These tips are about 2 or $3 each!
:As soon as I put a new tip in I tin it.
:I'm usin radio Shack's rosin solder paste.
:
:How can I keep these tips from deterioating so fast??
:
:I use the Iron.. or leave it on maybe 4 - 5 hours every other day or so.
:But these tips start rotting away after a week or two.
:Would this happen with a controled temp station?
:
:BTW:
:Due to loss of mostly all fingers on my right hand I have very limited grasping ability with my right hand so I can only pinch/hold/grasp the pencil iron by the flat cord at the top and let it rest against the palm area.
:Anyway that's why I kinda need a pencil shaped iron.
:But I hate going through so many tips.
:Any ideas?
:
:
:

:What the heck is a "princess" style iron?
:
:I have the weller SP23L 25watt pencil iron and the radio shack pencil iron too.
:I really like the weller. The problem I sem to have is that the tips keep rotting away.
:I use the Weller brand chisel tip.
:MT3 - Chisel Tip 1/8" (SP23)
:These tips are about 2 or $3 each!
:As soon as I put a new tip in I tin it.

My Princess iron is Ungar #86918 (Ungar was absorbed by Weller, a division of Cooper Industries). It uses the Ubgar #6961 iron clad pionted tip. The heating element is rated at 18 watts, 120 volts AC/DC. It's no good for larger solder joints but is perfect for transistors, diodes, etc. mounted in PCB's. I never used a soldering station. Those were used in rework locations. I worked in the field and used the Princess iron for on site PCB repair. If we coulden't fix it on site we returned it for rework. About the only boards that we had trouble repairing were memory sense amps. Flip-flops, one shots, double drivers, inverters, and gates were a piece of cake. Low heat equals no lifting of the circuit foil from the phenolic board.

Will

:I'm usin radio Shack's rosin solder paste.
:
:How can I keep these tips from deterioating so fast??
:
:I use the Iron.. or leave it on maybe 4 - 5 hours every other day or so.
:But these tips start rotting away after a week or two.
:Would this happen with a controled temp station?
:
:BTW:
:Due to loss of mostly all fingers on my right hand I have very limited grasping ability with my right hand so I can only pinch/hold/grasp the pencil iron by the flat cord at the top and let it rest against the palm area.
:Anyway that's why I kinda need a pencil shaped iron.
:But I hate going through so many tips.
:Any ideas?
:
:
:

:What the heck is a "princess" style iron?
:
:I have the weller SP23L 25watt pencil iron and the radio shack pencil iron too.
:I really like the weller. The problem I sem to have is that the tips keep rotting away.
:I use the Weller brand chisel tip.
:MT3 - Chisel Tip 1/8" (SP23)
:These tips are about 2 or $3 each!
:As soon as I put a new tip in I tin it.

Peter,
Here are the instructions on an unopened Ungar tip package that I have "Tip usage and tinning. Do not File. Iron Clad: For extra tip life always add solder to tip while iron is idling. Copper alloy tips: Apply solder to tip within 60 to 90 seconds. Let idle 2 or 3 minutes.,,apply additional solder...idle for a few seconds...wipe on a damp sponge...add fresh solder to tip. For extra tip life always add solder to tip while iron is idling.
Will
:I'm usin radio Shack's rosin solder paste.
:
:How can I keep these tips from deterioating so fast??
:
:I use the Iron.. or leave it on maybe 4 - 5 hours every other day or so.
:But these tips start rotting away after a week or two.
:Would this happen with a controled temp station?
:
:BTW:
:Due to loss of mostly all fingers on my right hand I have very limited grasping ability with my right hand so I can only pinch/hold/grasp the pencil iron by the flat cord at the top and let it rest against the palm area.
:Anyway that's why I kinda need a pencil shaped iron.
:But I hate going through so many tips.
:Any ideas?
:
:
:

Peter, what kills the tips is what has been called the idle time. The tip has no load on it (temperture wise) and literally burns it self up. The solder stations control the temperature, that is, keeps it in a certain range so it doe not "over heat". I also have the same problem. I tried un-plugging between action but then you have to wait for it to heat up again. If you could get some sort of temperature sensor to shut it off and on again you would be making your own work station. Pat

Great info Pat... You are probably right.
I spoke with a Weller sales rep today and she was most cooperative... she said she would chat with the Weller tech reps and get me an exact answer by next week...
I'n the mean time I found a source of relatively cheap weeler tip.
Elextronix Express:
http://www.elexp.com/sdr_sp23.htm
They are selling the tips I want at only $1.90 each in 10+ quantities.
So I ordered ten... lol

As an after thought.
.. if you are right about the tips buring from no load... then do you suppose I could get a real big hunk'o metal as a heatsink and drill a deep hole in it a little larger than the tip... and stick the tip in there as a resting spot?
This way it'll keep the tip at a cooler temp but not too cool so I can solder quickly.
What do you think?

For those on a limited budget with basic wiring/electrical skills, a basic lamp dimmer attached to a wall socket inside a square box provides an elementary temp. control and on/off switch for soldering irons, and beats the price 10 fold for the Weller soldering stations. Used one for years, before I found a box of scrap at work, and put a station together for myself. As for the Ungar Princess mentioned in an earlier post, I have an antique ('60's) for very light duty work, but find the million amp stiff power cord renders this light duty marvel a real pain. I developed CTS years ago trying to use it in tight places, and its for sale at the right price.

marv

:As an after thought.
:.. if you are right about the tips buring from no load... then do you suppose I could get a real big hunk'o metal as a heatsink and drill a deep hole in it a little larger than the tip... and stick the tip in there as a resting spot?
:This way it'll keep the tip at a cooler temp but not too cool so I can solder quickly.
:What do you think?
:

The dimmer is a handy suggestion and it works well in many applications. Here comes the but....but temperature control is not the same as temperature regulation. Without a thermal load on a non regulated iron (i.e. resting in its' stand) the temperature can climb quite high, say 800-1000 degrees, which will increase the decay of the tip. With a temperature regulating station the iron heater coil cuts out at a preset temperature, usually around 700 degrees, which prolongs tip life. This also helps to prevent circuit board delamination and pad lifting given proper tip selection and soldering technique are used. The dimmer will help but it is effectively reducing the wattage of the iron by reducing or pulsing the input voltage. One technique would be to turn down the dimmer in between soldering tasks. This way you don't have to wait as long for the iron to reach working temperature. If you do any soldering of static sensitive component don't use the dimmer. There may be voltage spikes at the tip which are large enough to damage those components.

Hope this helps
MRO

:For those on a limited budget with basic wiring/electrical skills, a basic lamp dimmer attached to a wall socket inside a square box provides an elementary temp. control and on/off switch for soldering irons, and beats the price 10 fold for the Weller soldering stations. Used one for years, before I found a box of scrap at work, and put a station together for myself. As for the Ungar Princess mentioned in an earlier post, I have an antique ('60's) for very light duty work, but find the million amp stiff power cord renders this light duty marvel a real pain. I developed CTS years ago trying to use it in tight places, and its for sale at the right price.
:
:marv
:
::As an after thought.
::.. if you are right about the tips buring from no load... then do you suppose I could get a real big hunk'o metal as a heatsink and drill a deep hole in it a little larger than the tip... and stick the tip in there as a resting spot?
::This way it'll keep the tip at a cooler temp but not too cool so I can solder quickly.
::What do you think?
::

I take it everyone is not talking about Weller gun type irons. Radio Shack sells pairs of tips for these for only a dollar or two.

Peter, too bad you aren't in Milwaukee (or maybe I could ship one of these items to you). Our American Science and Surplus store has tons of space heater (or percolator...whatever) temperature control units. If you could figure out what temperature works best for soldering, you could arrange a metal rest for the tip that attached to the bi-metallic spring of one of these jobbers. Adjust the thermostat appropriately. Every time you set down the iron, the tip will rest in the thermostat, and the stat will open whenever the tip gets above the appropriate temperature. Whenever you lift the iron from the rest, the stat will turn the iron back on full force. These stats only cost about 50 cents. Most have the bi-metallic spring insulated from the contacts by porcelain. You'd just have to be careful not to let yourself or anything else touch the contacts, because they'd be hooked to the line cord. As far as shock hazard goes, well, you could hook them to a polarized plug, but the shock hazard would still exist whenever they open, because the current would flow to one of the points through the soldering iron. Not enough current to cause damage, but a shock hazard, just the same (if you are concerned about this). However, seeing as the stat would be piping hot whenever it opened, the burn would be enough to get you away from it anyway. Mount the affair to a board via a coat hanger assembly (to minimize transfer of heat), and mount the board to your bench so that it can't move around. If you wanted, regarding shock hazards, you could even build a small tin box around the stat, with a slot for the iron tip. This would keep your fingers and arms away from the contacts.

Thanks all for the really creative ideas.
Well now I've got 10 tips on order... that should keep me happy for a while...
But I think I'll keep my eyes open for a slab of iron about the size of a brick. If I can heat sink the tip in that while idle it seems like it might be viable...no?
.. now where's a solid iron brick around here...

I have a foot long piece of rail. Not interested in getting rid of it, though.

T>

Is that why the East/West railway no longer makes it from NY to Calif??... because there's a 1 foot section MISSING in Milwaukee

Basically.

T

Peter,
The iron block trick might help save the tip, but what about overtaxing the element trying to heat all that mass. Remember that resistance wire (the element) when cooled draws more current, and you may need a direct connection to Hoover Dam. Those fake ice bags for your styrofoam cooler contain some kind of salt(s), which are very good at heat/cold transfer. Perhaps a paper cup filled with this stuff and a hand carved hardwood rest might be a welcome addition to your bench. The salt(s) will either clean or destroy the tip though. I have many more Rube Goldbergs for your consideration.

marv

:Thanks all for the really creative ideas.
:Well now I've got 10 tips on order... that should keep me happy for a while...
:But I think I'll keep my eyes open for a slab of iron about the size of a brick. If I can heat sink the tip in that while idle it seems like it might be viable...no?
:.. now where's a solid iron brick around here...

Marv.. I didn't know that about ...(is it "nichrome) wire?
I din't think it was smart enough to adjust itself to maintain a certain heat level.

I can just hear those bearings squealing on the generators in Hoover dam now.

I think I might have some of those cooling thingies around here buried in the bathroom vanity somewhere hidden down there with God knows what left over ex-girlfriend junk. ... lol

But it does seem rather impractical...
so go ahead and dream up some more Rube Goldberg goodies for me.
( I wonder if there's even anyone left alive that still remembers him and his comic trip?)

Peter,
Well if you think about it, in order to get red hot, the resistance of the element has to go up with temperature, and conversley, down when cooler. Now here is an idea just waiting for implementation. How 'bout a 12 inch fan mounted at the opening of a 12 inch cone of fiberglas with a 1/4 inch hole at it's apex, and a spring loaded clamp inside the cone. Place a 1 lb block of dry ice in the clamp and aim the cone opening at the iron tip in it's nesting place. For hands free operation, a fan foot switch is recommended. The deluxe model would have a foot switched/solonoid controlled oscillating mechanism to offer double duty of personnel and iron cooler. Max occupancy would be limited to 1. As to the ex, you forgot the old cliche about "throwing out the bath water with the baby" or something like that. lol

marv

:Marv.. I didn't know that about ...(is it "nichrome) wire?
:I din't think it was smart enough to adjust itself to maintain a certain heat level.
:
:I can just hear those bearings squealing on the generators in Hoover dam now.
:
:I think I might have some of those cooling thingies around here buried in the bathroom vanity somewhere hidden down there with God knows what left over ex-girlfriend junk. ... lol
:
:But it does seem rather impractical...
:so go ahead and dream up some more Rube Goldberg goodies for me.
:( I wonder if there's even anyone left alive that still remembers him and his comic trip?)

I do not think that cooling your iron will bring generators to a hault at the Hoover dam. The iron only draws a few more watts when first turned on cold. You only want to cool the iron to a sensible temperature while at rest, to prevent decay of the tip. The iron will still be hot, and the resistance will still be almost as high as it is when the iron is at full temperature. When you use the iron in your radio, the parts in the radio also cool the iron to this "sensible" temperature, which doesn't cause generators to come to a hault.

I'm not too sure Thomas...lol
... ever since this hobby of repairing old radios has become increasingly popular I think I've noticed that soldering iron sales have skyrocketed... and the hydrogenerator repair technicians have been working overtime out there at Hoover dam.... so it must be true.

I'm getting angry, because Radio Shack wants to discontinue its components line. The radio repair boom must not have taken off yet in Milwaukee, though the guys at my Radio Shack store seem to know me well. I think that they will see a huge spike in MOSFET and 555 chip sales for this year at my store. Incidently, I managed to finally build a 6 to 12 volt converter for my car, and I still haven't approached the $70 price of a commercial one!

Thomas,
In the distant past Radio Shack was a catalog distributor, with I think 1 store front in Kansas City or St Louis. Used to buy all kinds of radio parts from them by mail, then Tandy came in. Now it sells a lot of high end finished products but very few repair parts, and those few are out of stock frequently. Except for us old timers fixing antique radios/TVs, we live in a throw-it-away world, I still long for the good old days of $0.43/gallon gas, the old Radio Shack (anybody remember PolyPaks) and the list is endless.

marv

:I'm getting angry, because Radio Shack wants to discontinue its components line. The radio repair boom must not have taken off yet in Milwaukee, though the guys at my Radio Shack store seem to know me well. I think that they will see a huge spike in MOSFET and 555 chip sales for this year at my store. Incidently, I managed to finally build a 6 to 12 volt converter for my car, and I still haven't approached the $70 price of a commercial one!

Yep, things are getting scarry. Just walk past all of the nightclubs on Milwaukee St. on a Saturday night. What is next? I don't want to know.

T.

Worried because these night clubs don't sell radio components?

Pete, the iron "brick" would work but it would drop temp of iron and when you pick it up you would have to wait for temp to restore. On the other hand as brick heats up the time would get shorter and shorter.
You'll have to guess at an appropriate size brick to hit a happy medium. Tom's idea is a work station and might be a good project. Pat

The sales rep at a Weller supplier talked to a manufactures rep... they told her to advise me that the Sp23L is suffering from exactly what we thought.. over heat from long usage.
It was designed for short term hobby usage.

They suggested a Weller W60P model.
That has a semiautomatic temp tip control.
But ...it's 60 Watts ... and I think that may be too hot for this work...
So if that's their best offer... maybe I can rig it up throuh a dimmer...
.. But Weller must have a 40 Watt pencil shaped iron in a temp controlled work station.
I'll do more research.

I have the W60P on my bench and have been using it for more than 20 years. It works great and the tips control the temp, I get 700 and 800 degree tips and have had no problems and tip life is years.
Greg

:The sales rep at a Weller supplier talked to a manufactures rep... they told her to advise me that the Sp23L is suffering from exactly what we thought.. over heat from long usage.
:It was designed for short term hobby usage.
:
:They suggested a Weller W60P model.
:That has a semiautomatic temp tip control.
:But ...it's 60 Watts ... and I think that may be too hot for this work...
:So if that's their best offer... maybe I can rig it up throuh a dimmer...
:.. But Weller must have a 40 Watt pencil shaped iron in a temp controlled work station.
:I'll do more research.
:

I will try to build a temperature regulator station when I feel better. Right now I'm too dizzy to work with that stuff.

T.

Greg:
That's great... where do you get these 700/800 degree tips?.. Does that mean that they don't get hotter than the 25-30 watt Sp23L I'm using?
What is the part number or ID of the tip?
Also what is the actual tip size?
I have oe of these soldering irons laying around here in an old desk I recently discovered. But it has a vey tiny 1/16" tip.
I think the 1/8" or so tip woild be better,
Also what about the 60watts vs the 25-40 watt temp?
You are usinbg it with 60watta on these same type discrete component radios?

:Greg:
:That's great... where do you get these 700/800 degree tips?.. Does that mean that they don't get hotter than the 25-30 watt Sp23L I'm using?
:What is the part number or ID of the tip?
:Also what is the actual tip size?
:I have oe of these soldering irons laying around here in an old desk I recently discovered. But it has a vey tiny 1/16" tip.
:I think the 1/8" or so tip woild be better,
:Also what about the 60watts vs the 25-40 watt temp?
:You are usinbg it with 60watta on these same type discrete component radios?
:

hi peter phil here,i got that $3.99 solder sucker today,well actully it was on sale for $3.49,works great. the silvertone is playing right now,a JIMMIE HENDIX guitar solo,sounds great .the radio is a early stereo. i no longer have to try heating 6 joints on a cap can anymore to get it off without breaking the board.now JANICE JOPLIN is on,never cared for her,always sounds like someone strangling a sick cat,anyway i didn't mean this thread to get so big so i just wanted to thank you for the info and your advise,phil.

Yes Phil.... you are welcome.
.. lol
now... I do believe in buying 'good' tools too...but when I compare THIS solder sucker to the $21 "soldapullit" name brand... I want to kick myself... because this $3.49 unit is such an exact clone that I can't believe I paid so much for the other one. And in daily use this one is really every bit as good if not better!!

Peter the higher wattage won't over heat the iron since it has temp contolling tips. The higher wattage will give you faster heat-up time and reserve heating capacity for heavier soldering jobs. No railroad job required.

MRO

:Yes Phil.... you are welcome.
:.. lol
:now... I do believe in buying 'good' tools too...but when I compare THIS solder sucker to the $21 "soldapullit" name brand... I want to kick myself... because this $3.49 unit is such an exact clone that I can't believe I paid so much for the other one. And in daily use this one is really every bit as good if not better!!
:

I get my tips at Active Components in Calgary. I use the 800 deg for general old radio work and I like the long 1/8" tip. I use the 700 deg long on circuit board stuff. For connections to a point on the chassis I have a Weller 75 watt uncontrolled with a 3/8 tip. Heat the conection point first and get the solder flowing and then push the lead into the molten solder and remove the iron at the same time to minimize overheating of the component. The chassis will sink the heat away very quickly.
Greg

:Greg:
:That's great... where do you get these 700/800 degree tips?.. Does that mean that they don't get hotter than the 25-30 watt Sp23L I'm using?
:What is the part number or ID of the tip?
:Also what is the actual tip size?
:I have oe of these soldering irons laying around here in an old desk I recently discovered. But it has a vey tiny 1/16" tip.
:I think the 1/8" or so tip woild be better,
:Also what about the 60watts vs the 25-40 watt temp?
:You are usinbg it with 60watta on these same type discrete component radios?
:

Well I dug up my old ( 30 yo) Weller W60P model and started using it tonignt.

I don't like the tiny 1/16" tip (it bends easily when hot)... so I'll go get me an 1/8" tip.
... BUT even though this thing is 60 watts... I find it great to work with compared to all the 25 and 30 watt units I've been using.
I guess 25-30 watts is a bit under rated for these big old clunker radios. Because tonight I discovered that with the 60 watt iron I find that I am touching the terminal joints for a much shorter period of time to achieve a nice melt such that I can suck it up w/the solder sucker... and for anything... the sloder starts to flow much quicker and I'm consequently not cooking the darned joint and everything around it. I'm on and off in a flash leaving all attached componets less distressed from over heating.
Now My big question is what tip to buy.... the 700 or 800 degree tips?
How do I know which is better for this work and comprable to what I'm experiencing tonight?

I tried measuring the tip temp with a glob of solder surrounding my temp probe tip... and it read about 750 degrees... and further back inside the allen screw that holds the tip in the heating element I read about 825 degrees.. so what the heck does that tell me?

help

700 degree should be fine. Get fine long point for fine work, fine-medium short point for tube sockets and broad tip for chasis lugs.

MRO

:Well I dug up my old ( 30 yo) Weller W60P model and started using it tonignt.
:
:I don't like the tiny 1/16" tip (it bends easily when hot)... so I'll go get me an 1/8" tip.
:... BUT even though this thing is 60 watts... I find it great to work with compared to all the 25 and 30 watt units I've been using.
:I guess 25-30 watts is a bit under rated for these big old clunker radios. Because tonight I discovered that with the 60 watt iron I find that I am touching the terminal joints for a much shorter period of time to achieve a nice melt such that I can suck it up w/the solder sucker... and for anything... the sloder starts to flow much quicker and I'm consequently not cooking the darned joint and everything around it. I'm on and off in a flash leaving all attached componets less distressed from over heating.
:Now My big question is what tip to buy.... the 700 or 800 degree tips?
:How do I know which is better for this work and comprable to what I'm experiencing tonight?
:
:I tried measuring the tip temp with a glob of solder surrounding my temp probe tip... and it read about 750 degrees... and further back inside the allen screw that holds the tip in the heating element I read about 825 degrees.. so what the heck does that tell me?
:
:help

Ok... Great thanks a ton.

Regarding the difference in temp along the shaft and temp of the iron, most have the temp control in the shaft and generally will be higher there so the tip will be at a lower temp due to it being out in the air. I think you will be fine with the W60P.

:Well I dug up my old ( 30 yo) Weller W60P model and started using it tonignt.
:
:I don't like the tiny 1/16" tip (it bends easily when hot)... so I'll go get me an 1/8" tip.
:... BUT even though this thing is 60 watts... I find it great to work with compared to all the 25 and 30 watt units I've been using.
:I guess 25-30 watts is a bit under rated for these big old clunker radios. Because tonight I discovered that with the 60 watt iron I find that I am touching the terminal joints for a much shorter period of time to achieve a nice melt such that I can suck it up w/the solder sucker... and for anything... the sloder starts to flow much quicker and I'm consequently not cooking the darned joint and everything around it. I'm on and off in a flash leaving all attached componets less distressed from over heating.
:Now My big question is what tip to buy.... the 700 or 800 degree tips?
:How do I know which is better for this work and comprable to what I'm experiencing tonight?
:
:I tried measuring the tip temp with a glob of solder surrounding my temp probe tip... and it read about 750 degrees... and further back inside the allen screw that holds the tip in the heating element I read about 825 degrees.. so what the heck does that tell me?
:
:help