Hello, I have been fixing up some old record players and need some advice. The toughest thing I have come across is the hardened rubber idler wheels. Does anyone have a tried or proven method for getting the rubber soft again. I have had great success on the electronics end, but would love to hear some pointers or tips on getting old record players sounding good again.
Thanks
David

:Hello, I have been fixing up some old record players and need some advice. The toughest thing I have come across is the hardened rubber idler wheels. Does anyone have a tried or proven method for getting the rubber soft again. I have had great success on the electronics end, but would love to hear some pointers or tips on getting old record players sounding good again.
:Thanks
:David

Hi David,

If the idlers still have some elasticity to them, then you may be able to use a rubber cleaner/revitalizer. If they have really hardened you may need to have them rebuilt. One place that I have used in the past is:

PHONOED@aol.com
Vintage Electronics
128 Buccaneer Drive
Hattiesburg, Ms 39402

Radiodoc

I have heard that break fluid will soften rubber, does that really work?

David,
Brake fluid will soften/dissolve neoprene rubber. I learned this from an unfortunate experience with an automatic transmission seal. Natural rubber of this age may be a different story, so caution is suggested. I recently coated an old speaker cone with watered down craft glue, which dries to a rubbery consistency. This might help if only the drive surface needs softening or the friction.

marv

:I have heard that break fluid will soften rubber, does that really work?

:David,
:Brake fluid will soften/dissolve neoprene rubber. I learned this from an unfortunate experience with an automatic transmission seal. Natural rubber of this age may be a different story, so caution is suggested. I recently coated an old speaker cone with watered down craft glue, which dries to a rubbery consistency. This might help if only the drive surface needs softening or the friction.
:
:marv
:
::I have heard that break fluid will soften rubber, does that really work?

::David,
::Brake fluid will soften/dissolve neoprene rubber. I learned this from an unfortunate experience with an automatic transmission seal. Natural rubber of this age may be a different story, so caution is suggested. I recently coated an old speaker cone with watered down craft glue, which dries to a rubbery consistency. This might help if only the drive surface needs softening or the friction.
::

Hello:
Take the idler out and soak in denatured alcahol.This sometimes will soften the rubber.
::marv
::
:::I have heard that break fluid will soften rubber, does that really work?

Hi I have heard that armor-all will soften up the suction cups used on the zenith t/o wavemagnets , maybe might work for these as well , but downside is takes a long time of soaking to soften up.
E.
:::David,
:::Brake fluid will soften/dissolve neoprene rubber. I learned this from an unfortunate experience with an automatic transmission seal. Natural rubber of this age may be a different story, so caution is suggested. I recently coated an old speaker cone with watered down craft glue, which dries to a rubbery consistency. This might help if only the drive surface needs softening or the friction.
:::
:
:
:
:Hello:
: Take the idler out and soak in denatured alcahol.This sometimes will soften the rubber.
:::marv
:::
::::I have heard that break fluid will soften rubber, does that really work?

The instructions on the Armor-All states not for use on steering wheels. I would assume that also means anywhere that frictional contact is required.

marv

:Hi I have heard that armor-all will soften up the suction cups used on the zenith t/o wavemagnets , maybe might work for these as well , but downside is takes a long time of soaking to soften up.
:E.
::::David,
::::Brake fluid will soften/dissolve neoprene rubber. I learned this from an unfortunate experience with an automatic transmission seal. Natural rubber of this age may be a different story, so caution is suggested. I recently coated an old speaker cone with watered down craft glue, which dries to a rubbery consistency. This might help if only the drive surface needs softening or the friction.
::::
::
::
::
::Hello:
:: Take the idler out and soak in denatured alcahol.This sometimes will soften the rubber.
::::marv
::::
:::::I have heard that break fluid will soften rubber, does that really work?

Brake fluid preserves the rubber used in brake systems. I do believe that this is natural rubber, as it swells in mineral oil (which is why manufacturers warn against the use of mineral oil in brake lines). Most drive wheels are natural rubber. I don't know if rubber can be re-softened.

Alcohol is a great way to remove oily residue. I don't think that it will soften rubber, though. It actually removes oils from the rubber.

www.west-techservices.com reconditions rubber wheels. I've reconditioned them myself using various methods. Radiator hoses and rubber grommets are effective on wheels with a drum surface to adhere to. Contact cement makes an excellent adhesive. Insert a drill bit or a smooth shaft that is lightly oiled. Spin on a grinding wheel and turn at an angle to the wheel's rotation to remove rubber. Rubber should come off fairly evenly. Difficult wheels to work with are the two part small-big wheels. Reducing the large wheel will make the turntable spin faster. Reducing the small wheel will make it turn more slowly. Remove only the smallest amounts of rubber in between speed tests. A speed test should only be made after at least 15 minutes of operation. This time period should be observed every time a test is made. This assures full warming of parts and oils, which assures maximum speed. Turntables typically spin more slowly when cold, if any speed changes do occur. When lubricating the idler wheel for a test or for grinding, take every precaution possible against over oiling the shaft. Too much oil will spin off and get onto the drive surfaces. Do not let any oil get onto your fingers. Moisten a cloth or tissue with oil and use this to apply oil to the shaft. 3-in-1 oil is the best viscosity for a turntable. Auto motor oil works well, but causes sluggish operation when cold with weaker motors. Some of the best turntables, in my opinion, are those driven by motors supplied with turntables designed for cutting records. These motors are often very strong, and regulate speed well. I, of course, still have trouble with these 115 volt motors when the line voltage climbs to 125 in the summer, but turning on all of my air conditioners reduces the speed well.

Idler wheels where the rubber is vulcanized to a disc (flat disc, no drum surface--drum like a brake drum in a car) must be rebuilt professionally. About the only successful method for rebuilding is molding rubber to the disc. I suppose you could use two rubber discs glued together and sandwiched above and below the metal disc. This might work. Turn on a grinder to smooth to the correct size.

Thomas

I don't know about brake fluid or any of the other ideas suggested. Armor All seems like the safest bet, though it could leave the surface too slippery. Antique Electronic Supply does sell a product called rubber renue, but I have no experience with it. The last phonograph I worked on I had to simply replace the idler wheel. Go to www.theVoiceofMusic.com website and Gary can probably supply you with what you need. He was very helpful to me. Good luck.

:Hello, I have been fixing up some old record players and need some advice. The toughest thing I have come across is the hardened rubber idler wheels. Does anyone have a tried or proven method for getting the rubber soft again. I have had great success on the electronics end, but would love to hear some pointers or tips on getting old record players sounding good again.
:Thanks
:David

:Does anyone have a tried or proven method for getting the rubber soft again.
:Thanks
:David

There are no "proven" method to revitalize rubber for long term results. I use lacquer thinner. Soak the rubber wheel in it for 15 seconds. Remove and while it is still wet, use 100 grit sandpaper to roughen the outer surface then dry the rubber immediately. Wait at least 30 minutes before using. This only works for -short term-, like testing the phonograph. I strongly suggest to have the idler either rebuilt or resurfaced (resurfacing means gluing a new layer of rubber like a VCR belt. It works, but it is to me another patch, like using duct-tape on a rusty muffler to keep it quiet).

As for Armor-All, this is the worst thing to do. It is silicone based. Similar to putting oil on your brakes pads.

Syl

Dave, I have not worked on phonographs but understand the idea behind the friction drives. I don't know the sizes (diameter [OD])involved but the idea came to me that if you can find rubber heater/radiator hose with an ID close to or a smidgen less than the OD of the pulley (wheel) you could cut off a slice stretch over pulley (maybe a dab of rubber cement here)and if wall too thick put on a shaft, chuck in drill press and use file to bring down to desired diameter. Most of those hoses are, I believe, still made of rubber. Heater hose can be bought by the foot and comes in two or three diameters and the radiator hose would be more difficult with the pre-formed type but comes in many diameters. Also check web for rubber hose although they may sell in bulk. For small pulleys vacuum tube hose may work. PL