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TUNG-SOL RELAY #678
12/25/2012 7:33:12 PMchip
HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
thanks for any help
12/25/2012 8:45:19 PMLewis L.
:HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
:thanks for any help


Chip:
Could you give a little more information? Googling the part gives too many hits to find the tree for the forest. Voltage? Purpose? Anything else?
Lewis

12/25/2012 9:48:41 PMRichard
:HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
:thanks for any help

I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216

With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.

Richard

12/25/2012 11:59:52 PMRich, W3HWJ
::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
::thanks for any help
:
:I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
:
:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
:
:With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
:
:Richard

Is this a vacuum tube thermal relay or an automotive seat belt switch?
Rich
:

12/26/2012 1:27:41 AMEdd
::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
::thanks for any help
:
:I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
:
:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
:
:With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
:
:Richard
:










Sir Chip. . . .


Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.


With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.


I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.


First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.


And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.


With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:


Using Ref:


(At velly-velly bottom of the page).


> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <


By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?

Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:



> > > Relevant Patent < < <




That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.


The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.


We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.


Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?

Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.

(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)


Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.


The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.


As per:



> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <



Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.


What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?




73's de Edd




Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,


and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.








12/26/2012 8:18:08 AMLewis L.
:::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
:::thanks for any help
::
::I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
::
::http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
::
::With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
::
::Richard
::
:
:
:

:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:Sir Chip. . . .
:
:
:Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.
:
:
:With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.
:
:
:I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.
:
:
:First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.
:
:
:And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.
:
:
:With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:
:
:
:Using Ref:
:
:
:(At velly-velly bottom of the page).
:
:
:
:
:> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <

:
:

:
:
:By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?
:
:
:
:Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:
:
:
:
:
:
:> > > Relevant Patent < < <

:
:

:
:
:
:
:
:
:That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.
:
:
:The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.
:
:
:We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.
:
:
:Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?
:
:
:
:Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.
:
:(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)
:
:
:Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.
:
:
:The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.
:
:
:As per:
:
:
:
:> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <

:
:

:
:
:
:Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.
:
:
:
:
:What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?
:
:
:
:
:
:
:73's de Edd

:
:
:
:
:
:Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,
:
:
:and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:

:
:

With Edd's diligent finding out what it might be, I think it can be rebuilt into a solid state device using a 555 timer and a small relay built into the case of the Tung-sol unit. Do you know the Voltage applied, the time delay, and is it NO or NC without power. Or, the Amperite company built zillions of those types for everybody, there might be an Amperite that is a direct replacement or usable with a little rewiring of the socket.
Lewis
:
:
:

12/26/2012 12:21:11 PM"Edd"enda
::::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
::::thanks for any help
:::
:::I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
:::
:::http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
:::
:::With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
:::
:::Richard
:::
::
::
::

::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::Sir Chip. . . .
::
::
::Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.
::
::
::With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.
::
::
::I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.
::
::
::First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.
::
::
::And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.
::
::
::With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:
::
::
::Using Ref:
::
::
::(At velly-velly bottom of the page).
::
::
::
::
::> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <

::
::

::
::
::By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?
::
::
::
::Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:
::
::
::
::
::
::> > > Relevant Patent < < <

::
::

::
::
::
::
::
::
::That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.
::
::
::The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.
::
::
::We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.
::
::
::Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?
::
::
::
::Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.
::
::(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)
::
::
::Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.
::
::
::The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.
::
::
::As per:
::
::
::
::> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <

::
::

::
::
::
::Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.
::
::
::
::
::What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?
::
::
::
::
::
::
::73's de Edd

::
::
::
::
::
::Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,
::
::
::and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::

::
::
:
:
:
:With Edd's diligent finding out what it might be, I think it can be rebuilt into a solid state device using a 555 timer and a small relay built into the case of the Tung-sol unit. Do you know the Voltage applied, the time delay, and is it NO or NC without power. Or, the Amperite company built zillions of those types for everybody, there might be an Amperite that is a direct replacement or usable with a little rewiring of the socket.
:Lewis
::
::
::
:
:









Sir Chip . . . .


AND . . . . by the FURTHER reading of the
fine print
in the contract of that E-baywatch seller. . . . . .

It seems like that another seller is presently offering a different Tung Sol part number 609 for 'bout 5 Amellican Dollah. It's being glass dome encased, like the more familiar Amperite units.


PLUSSSSSSS . . . . . that initially referenced sellers other 656 Tung Sol unit had experienced NO takers.


Now if further reference researching finds the heater voltage specs along with the time delay aspect, there is the possibility of a variant of mating the voltage supplied to a relays heater element.


AND probably, a longer time activation wait would be tolerable, or be NO problem at all.


Another Tung Sol Time Delay Relay offering:



> > >Tung Sol 609 Time Delay Relay < < <


Its relevant / blanket U.S. patent info:


(That's patents covering even an older generation technique . . . . . Which it is referencing . . . . but probably not using, since it utilizes the sag /or/contract effect of hot/cold response of a heated wire. Since the units glass dome WOULD permit viewing, I suspect / prefer the more reliable heater and thermal warp switch technology.)


> > >Patent 2074345 Referencing < < <


(And then activate . . . . " OPEN THIS CONENT IN ANOTHER WINDOW ")




Still more Time Delay Relays sources :


. . . . . but for sticker shock . . . . . price out a new stock item from current Allied Radio stock.






> > > Amperite < < <







> > > Old Radio Parts (VERY bottom of page--50x plus units) < < <







> > > Johnnys Gems---Bangkok Thailand . . . . assortment of 25 units < < <







73's de Edd




Early to rise and late to bed makes a man unhealthy, wealthy and DEAD.








12/26/2012 1:31:32 PMLewis
:::::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
:::::thanks for any help
::::
::::I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
::::
::::http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
::::
::::With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
::::
::::Richard
::::
:::
:::
:::

:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::Sir Chip. . . .
:::
:::
:::Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.
:::
:::
:::With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.
:::
:::
:::I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.
:::
:::
:::First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.
:::
:::
:::And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.
:::
:::
:::With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:
:::
:::
:::Using Ref:
:::
:::
:::(At velly-velly bottom of the page).
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <

:::
:::

:::
:::
:::By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?
:::
:::
:::
:::Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::> > > Relevant Patent < < <

:::
:::

:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.
:::
:::
:::The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.
:::
:::
:::We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.
:::
:::
:::Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?
:::
:::
:::
:::Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.
:::
:::(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)
:::
:::
:::Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.
:::
:::
:::The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.
:::
:::
:::As per:
:::
:::
:::
:::> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <

:::
:::

:::
:::
:::
:::Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::73's de Edd

:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,
:::
:::
:::and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::

:::
:::
::
::
::
::With Edd's diligent finding out what it might be, I think it can be rebuilt into a solid state device using a 555 timer and a small relay built into the case of the Tung-sol unit. Do you know the Voltage applied, the time delay, and is it NO or NC without power. Or, the Amperite company built zillions of those types for everybody, there might be an Amperite that is a direct replacement or usable with a little rewiring of the socket.
::Lewis
:::
:::
:::
::
::
:
:

:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:Sir Chip . . . .
:
:
:AND . . . . by the FURTHER reading of the
:fine print
: in the contract of that E-baywatch seller. . . . . .
:
: It seems like that another seller is presently offering a different Tung Sol part number 609 for 'bout 5 Amellican Dollah. It's being glass dome encased, like the more familiar Amperite units.
:
:
:PLUSSSSSSS . . . . . that initially referenced sellers other 656 Tung Sol unit had experienced NO takers.
:
:
:Now if further reference researching finds the heater voltage specs along with the time delay aspect, there is the possibility of a variant of mating the voltage supplied to a relays heater element.
:
:
:AND probably, a longer time activation wait would be tolerable, or be NO problem at all.
:
:
:Another Tung Sol Time Delay Relay offering:
:
:
:
:> > >Tung Sol 609 Time Delay Relay < < <

:
:

:
:
:
:
:Its relevant / blanket U.S. patent info:
:
:
:(That's patents covering even an older generation technique . . . . . Which it is referencing . . . . but probably not using, since it utilizes the sag /or/contract effect of hot/cold response of a heated wire. Since the units glass dome WOULD permit viewing, I suspect / prefer the more reliable heater and thermal warp switch technology.)
:
:
:
:
:> > >Patent 2074345 Referencing < < <

:
:

:(And then activate . . . . " OPEN THIS CONENT IN ANOTHER WINDOW ")
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:Still more Time Delay Relays sources :
:
:
:. . . . . but for sticker shock . . . . . price out a new stock item from current Allied Radio stock.
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:> > > Amperite < < <

:
:

:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:> > > Old Radio Parts (VERY bottom of page--50x plus units) < < <

:
:

:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:> > > Johnnys Gems---Bangkok Thailand . . . . assortment of 25 units < < <

:
:

:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:73's de Edd

:
:
:
:
:
:Early to rise and late to bed makes a man unhealthy, wealthy and DEAD.
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:

:
:


Sir Edd:
Have you any idea what the Voltage and contacts are on the original Tung-sol unit???
Varlet Lewis
(whatever that means)
:

12/26/2012 2:59:45 PMchip
::::::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
::::::thanks for any help
:::::
:::::I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
:::::
:::::http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
:::::
:::::With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
:::::
:::::Richard
:::::
::::
::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Sir Chip. . . .
::::
::::
::::Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.
::::
::::
::::With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.
::::
::::
::::I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.
::::
::::
::::First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.
::::
::::
::::And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.
::::
::::
::::With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:
::::
::::
::::Using Ref:
::::
::::
::::(At velly-velly bottom of the page).
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?
::::
::::
::::
::::Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::> > > Relevant Patent < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.
::::
::::
::::The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.
::::
::::
::::We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.
::::
::::
::::Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?
::::
::::
::::
::::Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.
::::
::::(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)
::::
::::
::::Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.
::::
::::
::::The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.
::::
::::
::::As per:
::::
::::
::::
::::> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::73's de Edd

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,
::::
::::
::::and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::

::::
::::
:::
:::
:::
:::With Edd's diligent finding out what it might be, I think it can be rebuilt into a solid state device using a 555 timer and a small relay built into the case of the Tung-sol unit. Do you know the Voltage applied, the time delay, and is it NO or NC without power. Or, the Amperite company built zillions of those types for everybody, there might be an Amperite that is a direct replacement or usable with a little rewiring of the socket.
:::Lewis
::::
::::
::::
:::
:::
::
::

::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::Sir Chip . . . .
::
::
::AND . . . . by the FURTHER reading of the
::fine print
:: in the contract of that E-baywatch seller. . . . . .
::
:: It seems like that another seller is presently offering a different Tung Sol part number 609 for 'bout 5 Amellican Dollah. It's being glass dome encased, like the more familiar Amperite units.
::
::
::PLUSSSSSSS . . . . . that initially referenced sellers other 656 Tung Sol unit had experienced NO takers.
::
::
::Now if further reference researching finds the heater voltage specs along with the time delay aspect, there is the possibility of a variant of mating the voltage supplied to a relays heater element.
::
::
::AND probably, a longer time activation wait would be tolerable, or be NO problem at all.
::
::
::Another Tung Sol Time Delay Relay offering:
::
::
::
::> > >Tung Sol 609 Time Delay Relay < < <

::
::

::
::
::
::
::Its relevant / blanket U.S. patent info:
::
::
::(That's patents covering even an older generation technique . . . . . Which it is referencing . . . . but probably not using, since it utilizes the sag /or/contract effect of hot/cold response of a heated wire. Since the units glass dome WOULD permit viewing, I suspect / prefer the more reliable heater and thermal warp switch technology.)
::
::
::
::
::> > >Patent 2074345 Referencing < < <

::
::

::(And then activate . . . . " OPEN THIS CONENT IN ANOTHER WINDOW ")
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::Still more Time Delay Relays sources :
::
::
::. . . . . but for sticker shock . . . . . price out a new stock item from current Allied Radio stock.
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::> > > Amperite < < <

::
::

::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::> > > Old Radio Parts (VERY bottom of page--50x plus units) < < <

::
::

::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::> > > Johnnys Gems---Bangkok Thailand . . . . assortment of 25 units < < <

::
::

::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::73's de Edd

::
::
::
::
::
::Early to rise and late to bed makes a man unhealthy, wealthy and DEAD.
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::

::
::
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:Sir Edd:
:Have you any idea what the Voltage and contacts are on the original Tung-sol unit???
:Varlet Lewis
:(whatever that means)
::
:
:
RIGHT : This unit is used for the Rca model 10T - 200 Colorvolt unit used to regulate a/c voltage for early color tv's. I wish I could find a wiring diagram, the unit did come with instruction, but I have none . The relay is a 3 prong unit(which looks just like the auto relay for Nash cars) 1 lead to transformer 1 lead to one side of the incoming a/c voltage with a string of 2 paired diodes and the last lead to the output outlet that goes to the tv set. I wonder if one could be made, I have looking at auto horn relays , but they are all 12v but I have noticed that the # 678 does come up on Google as PR678 for some of the horn relays listed on the parts express audio store and others?
12/26/2012 6:49:35 PMLewis L.
:::::::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
:::::::thanks for any help
::::::
::::::I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
::::::
::::::http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
::::::
::::::With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
::::::
::::::Richard
::::::
:::::
:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::Sir Chip. . . .
:::::
:::::
:::::Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.
:::::
:::::
:::::With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.
:::::
:::::
:::::I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.
:::::
:::::
:::::First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.
:::::
:::::
:::::And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.
:::::
:::::
:::::With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:
:::::
:::::
:::::Using Ref:
:::::
:::::
:::::(At velly-velly bottom of the page).
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <

:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
:::::By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::> > > Relevant Patent < < <

:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.
:::::
:::::
:::::The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.
:::::
:::::
:::::We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.
:::::
:::::
:::::Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.
:::::
:::::(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)
:::::
:::::
:::::Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.
:::::
:::::
:::::The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.
:::::
:::::
:::::As per:
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <

:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::73's de Edd

:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,
:::::
:::::
:::::and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
::::
::::
::::
::::With Edd's diligent finding out what it might be, I think it can be rebuilt into a solid state device using a 555 timer and a small relay built into the case of the Tung-sol unit. Do you know the Voltage applied, the time delay, and is it NO or NC without power. Or, the Amperite company built zillions of those types for everybody, there might be an Amperite that is a direct replacement or usable with a little rewiring of the socket.
::::Lewis
:::::
:::::
:::::
::::
::::
:::
:::

:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::Sir Chip . . . .
:::
:::
:::AND . . . . by the FURTHER reading of the
:::fine print
::: in the contract of that E-baywatch seller. . . . . .
:::
::: It seems like that another seller is presently offering a different Tung Sol part number 609 for 'bout 5 Amellican Dollah. It's being glass dome encased, like the more familiar Amperite units.
:::
:::
:::PLUSSSSSSS . . . . . that initially referenced sellers other 656 Tung Sol unit had experienced NO takers.
:::
:::
:::Now if further reference researching finds the heater voltage specs along with the time delay aspect, there is the possibility of a variant of mating the voltage supplied to a relays heater element.
:::
:::
:::AND probably, a longer time activation wait would be tolerable, or be NO problem at all.
:::
:::
:::Another Tung Sol Time Delay Relay offering:
:::
:::
:::
:::> > >Tung Sol 609 Time Delay Relay < < <

:::
:::

:::
:::
:::
:::
:::Its relevant / blanket U.S. patent info:
:::
:::
:::(That's patents covering even an older generation technique . . . . . Which it is referencing . . . . but probably not using, since it utilizes the sag /or/contract effect of hot/cold response of a heated wire. Since the units glass dome WOULD permit viewing, I suspect / prefer the more reliable heater and thermal warp switch technology.)
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::> > >Patent 2074345 Referencing < < <

:::
:::

:::(And then activate . . . . " OPEN THIS CONENT IN ANOTHER WINDOW ")
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::Still more Time Delay Relays sources :
:::
:::
:::. . . . . but for sticker shock . . . . . price out a new stock item from current Allied Radio stock.
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::> > > Amperite < < <

:::
:::

:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::> > > Old Radio Parts (VERY bottom of page--50x plus units) < < <

:::
:::

:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::> > > Johnnys Gems---Bangkok Thailand . . . . assortment of 25 units < < <

:::
:::

:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::73's de Edd

:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::Early to rise and late to bed makes a man unhealthy, wealthy and DEAD.
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::

:::
:::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::Sir Edd:
::Have you any idea what the Voltage and contacts are on the original Tung-sol unit???
::Varlet Lewis
::(whatever that means)
:::
::
::
:RIGHT : This unit is used for the Rca model 10T - 200 Colorvolt unit used to regulate a/c voltage for early color tv's. I wish I could find a wiring diagram, the unit did come with instruction, but I have none . The relay is a 3 prong unit(which looks just like the auto relay for Nash cars) 1 lead to transformer 1 lead to one side of the incoming a/c voltage with a string of 2 paired diodes and the last lead to the output outlet that goes to the tv set. I wonder if one could be made, I have looking at auto horn relays , but they are all 12v but I have noticed that the # 678 does come up on Google as PR678 for some of the horn relays listed on the parts express audio store and others?


Chip:
I think you are way off base with the auto parts. If my thinking is right, this relay heater was in series with the television, and connected the Voltage regulator whenever the TV was turned on, or something like that. It's been a looooonnnnng time since I worked on that kind of stuff, and the memory of it is dim, indeed. I'll look around and see if I can come up with exactly what's going on and let you know.
Lewis
:

12/26/2012 9:02:28 PMchip
::::::::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
::::::::thanks for any help
:::::::
:::::::I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
:::::::
:::::::http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
:::::::
:::::::With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
:::::::
:::::::Richard
:::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Sir Chip. . . .
::::::
::::::
::::::Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.
::::::
::::::
::::::With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.
::::::
::::::
::::::I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.
::::::
::::::
::::::First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.
::::::
::::::
::::::And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.
::::::
::::::
::::::With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:
::::::
::::::
::::::Using Ref:
::::::
::::::
::::::(At velly-velly bottom of the page).
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > > Relevant Patent < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.
::::::
::::::
::::::The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.
::::::
::::::
::::::We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.
::::::
::::::
::::::Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.
::::::
::::::(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)
::::::
::::::
::::::Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.
::::::
::::::
::::::The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.
::::::
::::::
::::::As per:
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::73's de Edd

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,
::::::
::::::
::::::and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::With Edd's diligent finding out what it might be, I think it can be rebuilt into a solid state device using a 555 timer and a small relay built into the case of the Tung-sol unit. Do you know the Voltage applied, the time delay, and is it NO or NC without power. Or, the Amperite company built zillions of those types for everybody, there might be an Amperite that is a direct replacement or usable with a little rewiring of the socket.
:::::Lewis
::::::
::::::
::::::
:::::
:::::
::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Sir Chip . . . .
::::
::::
::::AND . . . . by the FURTHER reading of the
::::fine print
:::: in the contract of that E-baywatch seller. . . . . .
::::
:::: It seems like that another seller is presently offering a different Tung Sol part number 609 for 'bout 5 Amellican Dollah. It's being glass dome encased, like the more familiar Amperite units.
::::
::::
::::PLUSSSSSSS . . . . . that initially referenced sellers other 656 Tung Sol unit had experienced NO takers.
::::
::::
::::Now if further reference researching finds the heater voltage specs along with the time delay aspect, there is the possibility of a variant of mating the voltage supplied to a relays heater element.
::::
::::
::::AND probably, a longer time activation wait would be tolerable, or be NO problem at all.
::::
::::
::::Another Tung Sol Time Delay Relay offering:
::::
::::
::::
::::> > >Tung Sol 609 Time Delay Relay < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Its relevant / blanket U.S. patent info:
::::
::::
::::(That's patents covering even an older generation technique . . . . . Which it is referencing . . . . but probably not using, since it utilizes the sag /or/contract effect of hot/cold response of a heated wire. Since the units glass dome WOULD permit viewing, I suspect / prefer the more reliable heater and thermal warp switch technology.)
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::> > >Patent 2074345 Referencing < < <

::::
::::

::::(And then activate . . . . " OPEN THIS CONENT IN ANOTHER WINDOW ")
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Still more Time Delay Relays sources :
::::
::::
::::. . . . . but for sticker shock . . . . . price out a new stock item from current Allied Radio stock.
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::> > > Amperite < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::> > > Old Radio Parts (VERY bottom of page--50x plus units) < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::> > > Johnnys Gems---Bangkok Thailand . . . . assortment of 25 units < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::73's de Edd

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Early to rise and late to bed makes a man unhealthy, wealthy and DEAD.
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::

::::
::::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::Sir Edd:
:::Have you any idea what the Voltage and contacts are on the original Tung-sol unit???
:::Varlet Lewis
:::(whatever that means)
::::
:::
:::
::RIGHT : This unit is used for the Rca model 10T - 200 Colorvolt unit used to regulate a/c voltage for early color tv's. I wish I could find a wiring diagram, the unit did come with instruction, but I have none . The relay is a 3 prong unit(which looks just like the auto relay for Nash cars) 1 lead to transformer 1 lead to one side of the incoming a/c voltage with a string of 2 paired diodes and the last lead to the output outlet that goes to the tv set. I wonder if one could be made, I have looking at auto horn relays , but they are all 12v but I have noticed that the # 678 does come up on Google as PR678 for some of the horn relays listed on the parts express audio store and others?
:
:
:Chip:
:I think you are way off base with the auto parts. If my thinking is right, this relay heater was in series with the television, and connected the Voltage regulator whenever the TV was turned on, or something like that. It's been a looooonnnnng time since I worked on that kind of stuff, and the memory of it is dim, indeed. I'll look around and see if I can come up with exactly what's going on and let you know.
:Lewis
::
:
:
WOW; Thank you guys for all the info and right the relay would have to be 120v. I will also ask play things of past if any of his relays would cross for the 678 also the pat # is 2761931. Using a present day timer probably would be the best way to go.
12/26/2012 9:09:55 PMchip
::::::::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
::::::::thanks for any help
:::::::
:::::::I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
:::::::
:::::::http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
:::::::
:::::::With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
:::::::
:::::::Richard
:::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Sir Chip. . . .
::::::
::::::
::::::Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.
::::::
::::::
::::::With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.
::::::
::::::
::::::I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.
::::::
::::::
::::::First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.
::::::
::::::
::::::And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.
::::::
::::::
::::::With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:
::::::
::::::
::::::Using Ref:
::::::
::::::
::::::(At velly-velly bottom of the page).
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > > Relevant Patent < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.
::::::
::::::
::::::The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.
::::::
::::::
::::::We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.
::::::
::::::
::::::Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.
::::::
::::::(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)
::::::
::::::
::::::Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.
::::::
::::::
::::::The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.
::::::
::::::
::::::As per:
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::73's de Edd

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,
::::::
::::::
::::::and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::With Edd's diligent finding out what it might be, I think it can be rebuilt into a solid state device using a 555 timer and a small relay built into the case of the Tung-sol unit. Do you know the Voltage applied, the time delay, and is it NO or NC without power. Or, the Amperite company built zillions of those types for everybody, there might be an Amperite that is a direct replacement or usable with a little rewiring of the socket.
:::::Lewis
::::::
::::::
::::::
:::::
:::::
::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Sir Chip . . . .
::::
::::
::::AND . . . . by the FURTHER reading of the
::::fine print
:::: in the contract of that E-baywatch seller. . . . . .
::::
:::: It seems like that another seller is presently offering a different Tung Sol part number 609 for 'bout 5 Amellican Dollah. It's being glass dome encased, like the more familiar Amperite units.
::::
::::
::::PLUSSSSSSS . . . . . that initially referenced sellers other 656 Tung Sol unit had experienced NO takers.
::::
::::
::::Now if further reference researching finds the heater voltage specs along with the time delay aspect, there is the possibility of a variant of mating the voltage supplied to a relays heater element.
::::
::::
::::AND probably, a longer time activation wait would be tolerable, or be NO problem at all.
::::
::::
::::Another Tung Sol Time Delay Relay offering:
::::
::::
::::
::::> > >Tung Sol 609 Time Delay Relay < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Its relevant / blanket U.S. patent info:
::::
::::
::::(That's patents covering even an older generation technique . . . . . Which it is referencing . . . . but probably not using, since it utilizes the sag /or/contract effect of hot/cold response of a heated wire. Since the units glass dome WOULD permit viewing, I suspect / prefer the more reliable heater and thermal warp switch technology.)
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::> > >Patent 2074345 Referencing < < <

::::
::::

::::(And then activate . . . . " OPEN THIS CONENT IN ANOTHER WINDOW ")
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Still more Time Delay Relays sources :
::::
::::
::::. . . . . but for sticker shock . . . . . price out a new stock item from current Allied Radio stock.
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::> > > Amperite < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::> > > Old Radio Parts (VERY bottom of page--50x plus units) < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::> > > Johnnys Gems---Bangkok Thailand . . . . assortment of 25 units < < <

::::
::::

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::73's de Edd

::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Early to rise and late to bed makes a man unhealthy, wealthy and DEAD.
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::

::::
::::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::
:::Sir Edd:
:::Have you any idea what the Voltage and contacts are on the original Tung-sol unit???
:::Varlet Lewis
:::(whatever that means)
::::
:::
:::
::RIGHT : This unit is used for the Rca model 10T - 200 Colorvolt unit used to regulate a/c voltage for early color tv's. I wish I could find a wiring diagram, the unit did come with instruction, but I have none . The relay is a 3 prong unit(which looks just like the auto relay for Nash cars) 1 lead to transformer 1 lead to one side of the incoming a/c voltage with a string of 2 paired diodes and the last lead to the output outlet that goes to the tv set. I wonder if one could be made, I have looking at auto horn relays , but they are all 12v but I have noticed that the # 678 does come up on Google as PR678 for some of the horn relays listed on the parts express audio store and others?
:
:
:Chip:
:I think you are way off base with the auto parts. If my thinking is right, this relay heater was in series with the television, and connected the Voltage regulator whenever the TV was turned on, or something like that. It's been a looooonnnnng time since I worked on that kind of stuff, and the memory of it is dim, indeed. I'll look around and see if I can come up with exactly what's going on and let you know.
:Lewis
::
:
:
WOW; Thank you guys for all the info and right the relay would have to be 120v. I will also ask play things of past if any of his relays would cross for the 678 also the pat # is 2761931. Using a present day timer probably would be the best way to go.
12/27/2012 3:10:15 AMEdd
:::::::::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
:::::::::thanks for any help
::::::::
::::::::I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
::::::::
::::::::http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
::::::::
::::::::With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
::::::::
::::::::Richard
::::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Sir Chip. . . .
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Using Ref:
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::(At velly-velly bottom of the page).
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <

:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::> > > Relevant Patent < < <

:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.
:::::::
:::::::(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::As per:
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <

:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::73's de Edd

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::With Edd's diligent finding out what it might be, I think it can be rebuilt into a solid state device using a 555 timer and a small relay built into the case of the Tung-sol unit. Do you know the Voltage applied, the time delay, and is it NO or NC without power. Or, the Amperite company built zillions of those types for everybody, there might be an Amperite that is a direct replacement or usable with a little rewiring of the socket.
::::::Lewis
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
::::::
::::::
:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::Sir Chip . . . .
:::::
:::::
:::::AND . . . . by the FURTHER reading of the
:::::fine print
::::: in the contract of that E-baywatch seller. . . . . .
:::::
::::: It seems like that another seller is presently offering a different Tung Sol part number 609 for 'bout 5 Amellican Dollah. It's being glass dome encased, like the more familiar Amperite units.
:::::
:::::
:::::PLUSSSSSSS . . . . . that initially referenced sellers other 656 Tung Sol unit had experienced NO takers.
:::::
:::::
:::::Now if further reference researching finds the heater voltage specs along with the time delay aspect, there is the possibility of a variant of mating the voltage supplied to a relays heater element.
:::::
:::::
:::::AND probably, a longer time activation wait would be tolerable, or be NO problem at all.
:::::
:::::
:::::Another Tung Sol Time Delay Relay offering:
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::> > >Tung Sol 609 Time Delay Relay < < <

:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::Its relevant / blanket U.S. patent info:
:::::
:::::
:::::(That's patents covering even an older generation technique . . . . . Which it is referencing . . . . but probably not using, since it utilizes the sag /or/contract effect of hot/cold response of a heated wire. Since the units glass dome WOULD permit viewing, I suspect / prefer the more reliable heater and thermal warp switch technology.)
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::> > >Patent 2074345 Referencing < < <

:::::
:::::

:::::(And then activate . . . . " OPEN THIS CONENT IN ANOTHER WINDOW ")
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::Still more Time Delay Relays sources :
:::::
:::::
:::::. . . . . but for sticker shock . . . . . price out a new stock item from current Allied Radio stock.
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::> > > Amperite < < <

:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::> > > Old Radio Parts (VERY bottom of page--50x plus units) < < <

:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::> > > Johnnys Gems---Bangkok Thailand . . . . assortment of 25 units < < <

:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::73's de Edd

:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::Early to rise and late to bed makes a man unhealthy, wealthy and DEAD.
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::

:::::
:::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::
::::Sir Edd:
::::Have you any idea what the Voltage and contacts are on the original Tung-sol unit???
::::Varlet Lewis
::::(whatever that means)
:::::
::::
::::
:::RIGHT : This unit is used for the Rca model 10T - 200 Colorvolt unit used to regulate a/c voltage for early color tv's. I wish I could find a wiring diagram, the unit did come with instruction, but I have none . The relay is a 3 prong unit(which looks just like the auto relay for Nash cars) 1 lead to transformer 1 lead to one side of the incoming a/c voltage with a string of 2 paired diodes and the last lead to the output outlet that goes to the tv set. I wonder if one could be made, I have looking at auto horn relays , but they are all 12v but I have noticed that the # 678 does come up on Google as PR678 for some of the horn relays listed on the parts express audio store and others?
::
::
::Chip:
::I think you are way off base with the auto parts. If my thinking is right, this relay heater was in series with the television, and connected the Voltage regulator whenever the TV was turned on, or something like that. It's been a looooonnnnng time since I worked on that kind of stuff, and the memory of it is dim, indeed. I'll look around and see if I can come up with exactly what's going on and let you know.
::Lewis
:::
::
::
: WOW; Thank you guys for all the info and right the relay would have to be 120v. I will also ask play things of past if any of his relays would cross for the 678 also the pat # is 2761931. Using a present day timer probably would be the best way to go.
:









Sir Chip. . . .


AaaaaaaaaH Haaaaa . . . . . more forthcoming info.


No more "consumptions" now required . . . . . .BUT with more questions, yet to be answered.


First is, HAS that unit been used for the last 50 years, as it was designed for, and that is for an old first generation TV of the 54-60's and their power consumptions of up in 350-450 watts of power ?


And mainly, the unit being tied into a poorly regulated AC power line source . . .e.g. . . .like an REA stations line with long power line runs, that could fluctuate wildly with different line loading conditions.


Or is it a non working / or failed new toy for you, to be used for . . .I don't know what ?


If the LATTER situation and you know nothing about it, let me clue you in just minimally, initially.


That unit can take in a low AC line voltage . .say 'bout 90VAC and feed into its internal Sola voltage regulating /resonant saturable reactor transformers primary and automatically will regulate it into the 118-120VAC level.


If your incoming AC line voltage just happens to be in the order of that 118 VAC initially, the transformer core will be going into its saturated threshold a bit and the top and bottom nodes of the AC will be compressed a bit as shown on my illustration.




As you up the primary AC input voltage even further towards the transformers upper spec of ~135VAC, those peak nodes will compress down even more and have the once sine wave, compressing on down into a quasi squashed square wave. And then, since the core is so saturated, no stronger magnetic fied will be created to be able to induce a greater magnetic field into the secondary and raise the secondary voltage output.


Thereby, by different progressive degrees of going into saturation of the core of the transformer, within the 95-135VAC input range, results in a quite stable output AC voltage.


If being used above the nominal 118VAC input the secondary puts out a nastier waveform, the Sola transformer is inherently a bit noisy . . . .HUMMMMMM . . . and it WARMS up a bit and PULLS AC line current even WITHOUTa plugged in load. (Thats due to its transformer needing to be into a subsaturated threshold.)


Sooooooo with the latter aspects of the heating up of the unit and its quiescent current consumption, even with no TV load on the unit, we get to the aspect of why there is a relay being associated with the unit.


Thats not a good situation to have a " bun warmer " unit setting there plugged in, and pulling 40-60-80 watts continually for 24-7 even if the Color TV is not turned on and THEN pulling its additional slightly less than half a kilowatt.


Soooooothat was your relays function.


Notice the units AC power cord line that goes over to the AC wall receptacle and additionally, there is the female AC receptacle on the unit that is marked for the load /TV set to be plugged into.


The end result, is that the AC into the unit is being disconnected by the relay, until the TV is turned on and that resistance presence has then been detected and initiates the RCA 10-T-200 to then supply regulated AC power to the TV set.


When the TV is turned off at the set, all reverts and goes Stone Cold Steve Austin again with the RCA 10-T-200 unit.


Soooooo . . . . . If your relay is bad, and you now tell us that it is configured with 3 terminals versus the socket and pins.


Lift free, 2 of its 3 terminals external wiring and ohm out between them to ascertain 10's on up to a 100 or so of ohmmage of either a coil winding or thermal heater, in case it's a bimetallic time delay relay. If that test confirms resistance present, then the fault probably will be due to pitted /blackened open relay contacts, from long time switching of a 500 watt load..


Thats the point where I would be disassembling the relays cover to see precisely whats inside, to know what corrective action is needed to repair the relay.


Yet 2 more workarounds . . .on not using the relay and its load presence capability:


Since you are probably NOT using an old classic color TV with it daily, so I would then visually examine, within the relay, to see what 2 of the 3 connections are made between, when the relay activates, and then shunt them with an external wire across those relay terms.


Then when you want to use the unit, plug it into the AC wall receptacle or a switched power strip or install a rocker switch inside the RCA 10-T-200 units case in series with the incoming AC line.


Finally let us know if the planned use is for a different purpose, other than which the unit was designed for.

73's de Edd




Some ecological circumstantial evidence is very strong, such as when you find a trout in the milk.









12/27/2012 9:41:40 AMLewis
::::::::::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
::::::::::thanks for any help
:::::::::
:::::::::I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
:::::::::
:::::::::http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
:::::::::
:::::::::With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
:::::::::
:::::::::Richard
:::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::

::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::Sir Chip. . . .
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::Using Ref:
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::(At velly-velly bottom of the page).
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <

::::::::
::::::::

::::::::
::::::::
::::::::By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::> > > Relevant Patent < < <

::::::::
::::::::

::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.
::::::::
::::::::(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::As per:
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <

::::::::
::::::::

::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::73's de Edd

::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::

::::::::
::::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::With Edd's diligent finding out what it might be, I think it can be rebuilt into a solid state device using a 555 timer and a small relay built into the case of the Tung-sol unit. Do you know the Voltage applied, the time delay, and is it NO or NC without power. Or, the Amperite company built zillions of those types for everybody, there might be an Amperite that is a direct replacement or usable with a little rewiring of the socket.
:::::::Lewis
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
:::::::
:::::::
::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Sir Chip . . . .
::::::
::::::
::::::AND . . . . by the FURTHER reading of the
::::::fine print
:::::: in the contract of that E-baywatch seller. . . . . .
::::::
:::::: It seems like that another seller is presently offering a different Tung Sol part number 609 for 'bout 5 Amellican Dollah. It's being glass dome encased, like the more familiar Amperite units.
::::::
::::::
::::::PLUSSSSSSS . . . . . that initially referenced sellers other 656 Tung Sol unit had experienced NO takers.
::::::
::::::
::::::Now if further reference researching finds the heater voltage specs along with the time delay aspect, there is the possibility of a variant of mating the voltage supplied to a relays heater element.
::::::
::::::
::::::AND probably, a longer time activation wait would be tolerable, or be NO problem at all.
::::::
::::::
::::::Another Tung Sol Time Delay Relay offering:
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > >Tung Sol 609 Time Delay Relay < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Its relevant / blanket U.S. patent info:
::::::
::::::
::::::(That's patents covering even an older generation technique . . . . . Which it is referencing . . . . but probably not using, since it utilizes the sag /or/contract effect of hot/cold response of a heated wire. Since the units glass dome WOULD permit viewing, I suspect / prefer the more reliable heater and thermal warp switch technology.)
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > >Patent 2074345 Referencing < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::(And then activate . . . . " OPEN THIS CONENT IN ANOTHER WINDOW ")
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Still more Time Delay Relays sources :
::::::
::::::
::::::. . . . . but for sticker shock . . . . . price out a new stock item from current Allied Radio stock.
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > > Amperite < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > > Old Radio Parts (VERY bottom of page--50x plus units) < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::> > > Johnnys Gems---Bangkok Thailand . . . . assortment of 25 units < < <

::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::73's de Edd

::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Early to rise and late to bed makes a man unhealthy, wealthy and DEAD.
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::

::::::
::::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::
:::::Sir Edd:
:::::Have you any idea what the Voltage and contacts are on the original Tung-sol unit???
:::::Varlet Lewis
:::::(whatever that means)
::::::
:::::
:::::
::::RIGHT : This unit is used for the Rca model 10T - 200 Colorvolt unit used to regulate a/c voltage for early color tv's. I wish I could find a wiring diagram, the unit did come with instruction, but I have none . The relay is a 3 prong unit(which looks just like the auto relay for Nash cars) 1 lead to transformer 1 lead to one side of the incoming a/c voltage with a string of 2 paired diodes and the last lead to the output outlet that goes to the tv set. I wonder if one could be made, I have looking at auto horn relays , but they are all 12v but I have noticed that the # 678 does come up on Google as PR678 for some of the horn relays listed on the parts express audio store and others?
:::
:::
:::Chip:
:::I think you are way off base with the auto parts. If my thinking is right, this relay heater was in series with the television, and connected the Voltage regulator whenever the TV was turned on, or something like that. It's been a looooonnnnng time since I worked on that kind of stuff, and the memory of it is dim, indeed. I'll look around and see if I can come up with exactly what's going on and let you know.
:::Lewis
::::
:::
:::
:: WOW; Thank you guys for all the info and right the relay would have to be 120v. I will also ask play things of past if any of his relays would cross for the 678 also the pat # is 2761931. Using a present day timer probably would be the best way to go.
::
:
:

:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:Sir Chip. . . .
:
:
:AaaaaaaaaH Haaaaa . . . . . more forthcoming info.
:
:
:No more "consumptions" now required . . . . . .BUT with more questions, yet to be answered.
:
:
:First is, HAS that unit been used for the last 50 years, as it was designed for, and that is for an old first generation TV of the 54-60's and their power consumptions of up in 350-450 watts of power ?
:
:
:And mainly, the unit being tied into a poorly regulated AC power line source . . .e.g. . . .like an REA stations line with long power line runs, that could fluctuate wildly with different line loading conditions.
:
:
:Or is it a non working / or failed new toy for you, to be used for . . .I don't know what ?
:
:
:If the LATTER situation and you know nothing about it, let me clue you in just minimally, initially.
:
:
:That unit can take in a low AC line voltage . .say 'bout 90VAC and feed into its internal Sola voltage regulating /resonant saturable reactor transformers primary and automatically will regulate it into the 118-120VAC level.
:
:
: If your incoming AC line voltage just happens to be in the order of that 118 VAC initially, the transformer core will be going into its saturated threshold a bit and the top and bottom nodes of the AC will be compressed a bit as shown on my illustration.
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:As you up the primary AC input voltage even further towards the transformers upper spec of ~135VAC, those peak nodes will compress down even more and have the once sine wave, compressing on down into a quasi squashed square wave. And then, since the core is so saturated, no stronger magnetic fied will be created to be able to induce a greater magnetic field into the secondary and raise the secondary voltage output.
:
:
:Thereby, by different progressive degrees of going into saturation of the core of the transformer, within the 95-135VAC input range, results in a quite stable output AC voltage.
:
:
:If being used above the nominal 118VAC input the secondary puts out a nastier waveform, the Sola transformer is inherently a bit noisy . . . .HUMMMMMM . . . and it WARMS up a bit and PULLS AC line current even WITHOUTa plugged in load. (Thats due to its transformer needing to be into a subsaturated threshold.)
:
:
:Sooooooo with the latter aspects of the heating up of the unit and its quiescent current consumption, even with no TV load on the unit, we get to the aspect of why there is a relay being associated with the unit.
:
:
:Thats not a good situation to have a " bun warmer " unit setting there plugged in, and pulling 40-60-80 watts continually for 24-7 even if the Color TV is not turned on and THEN pulling its additional slightly less than half a kilowatt.
:
:
:Soooooothat was your relays function.
:
:
:Notice the units AC power cord line that goes over to the AC wall receptacle and additionally, there is the female AC receptacle on the unit that is marked for the load /TV set to be plugged into.
:
:
:The end result, is that the AC into the unit is being disconnected by the relay, until the TV is turned on and that resistance presence has then been detected and initiates the RCA 10-T-200 to then supply regulated AC power to the TV set.
:
:
:When the TV is turned off at the set, all reverts and goes Stone Cold Steve Austin again with the RCA 10-T-200 unit.
:
:
:Soooooo . . . . . If your relay is bad, and you now tell us that it is configured with 3 terminals versus the socket and pins.
:
:
:Lift free, 2 of its 3 terminals external wiring and ohm out between them to ascertain 10's on up to a 100 or so of ohmmage of either a coil winding or thermal heater, in case it's a bimetallic time delay relay. If that test confirms resistance present, then the fault probably will be due to pitted /blackened open relay contacts, from long time switching of a 500 watt load..
:
:
:Thats the point where I would be disassembling the relays cover to see precisely whats inside, to know what corrective action is needed to repair the relay.
:
:
:Yet 2 more workarounds . . .on not using the relay and its load presence capability:
:
:
:Since you are probably NOT using an old classic color TV with it daily, so I would then visually examine, within the relay, to see what 2 of the 3 connections are made between, when the relay activates, and then shunt them with an external wire across those relay terms.
:
:
:Then when you want to use the unit, plug it into the AC wall receptacle or a switched power strip or install a rocker switch inside the RCA 10-T-200 units case in series with the incoming AC line.
:
:
:Finally let us know if the planned use is for a different purpose, other than which the unit was designed for.
:
:
:
:73's de Edd

:
:
:
:
:
:Some ecological circumstantial evidence is very strong, such as when you find a trout in the milk.
:
:
:
:
:
:
:
:

:
:


Edd has sparked a little memory here....When the TV was first turned on, the tube filaments were cold and drew a lot more current. The time delay was to let the filaments warm up and draw less current before the regulator was switched into the circuit.
Lewis
:
:

1/1/2013 12:28:21 PMchip
:::::::::::HI; Looking for a replacement for this relay?
:::::::::::thanks for any help
::::::::::
::::::::::I came up empty with my Tung-Sol literature. A quick search of the WEB yielded a single reference:
::::::::::
::::::::::http://groups.yahoo.com/group/heathkit/message/21216
::::::::::
::::::::::With someone else inquiring about a Tung-Sol 678 relay.
::::::::::
::::::::::Richard
::::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::

:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::Sir Chip. . . .
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::Now since you say you are NEEDING one and not just FINDING one and wondering WHAT it is.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::With Lewis's comment of the quantity of possibilities BUT with a yet a further selective "culling" via (+) and (" ") utilization.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::I then come up with that infos sequentially derived hypothesis.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::First info, is that of an E-bay TUNG Sol relay.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::And Tung Sol's relay division is not exactly a household name anymore, with their last heyday probably being their automotive turn indicator flashers and "beep-beep" horn relays for vehicles.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::With the provided minimal initial info input, I possibly come up with a sequentially derived potential hypothesis:
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::Using Ref:
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::(At velly-velly bottom of the page).
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::> > >A 600 series Tung Sol Relay> < < <

:::::::::
:::::::::

:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::By using that references photo you can then see if your relay is built / configured in that manner. A cylindrical metal housing with what looks like an octal socket on its bottom, unless they have thrown in a 9th pin ?
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::Next, since the photos frontal position did not reveal a possible pin out schema on its rear side , we research the US Pat # 2388712 as:
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::> > > Relevant Patent < < <

:::::::::
:::::::::

:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::That olde "grandfather" patent is using 4 active connections, with 2 of those connections being relevant to an electrical heater element, which heats and activates , a thermal bi metallic warp switch to close.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::The units other 2 connections are being for that electrically isolated thermal switch.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::We come up with a time delay relay, with the 4 leads mated to the units octal ? socket.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::Nooooooow . . . .is there a possibility that the Tung Sol 600series of 656-678 are different spread out offerings of different heater voltages and /or turn on time delay specifications ?
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::Finally, as for that units application, I have run into such devices, being used in Tek scopes as the time delay for holding off B+ supply while the units tube filaments are warming up to operating temp.
:::::::::
:::::::::(However, with the glass octal Amperite being the forerunner supplier.)
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::Also, in Ye Olde Tyme RCA Color Volt AC Supply Unit, they had married a Sola constant voltage / saturable reactor transformer with its resonating capacitor AND this type of thermal relay.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::The relays heater portion unit is activated by a series connected AC power application and the then heated thermal switch portion, timely engages the regulated output AC power to the connected load, that is plugged into it.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::As per:
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::> > >RCA Colorvolt Regulated AC Supply Unit> < < <

:::::::::
:::::::::

:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::Finally . . . if UN-OBTAIN-IUM . . . .this devices function could be replicated with more modern parts.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::What say you now . . . for further incoming info to us?
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::73's de Edd

:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::Typically . . . . .parents spend three years teaching their kids to talk,
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::and then spend the rest of their lives trying to get them to keep quiet.
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::

:::::::::
:::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
::::::::With Edd's diligent finding out what it might be, I think it can be rebuilt into a solid state device using a 555 timer and a small relay built into the case of the Tung-sol unit. Do you know the Voltage applied, the time delay, and is it NO or NC without power. Or, the Amperite company built zillions of those types for everybody, there might be an Amperite that is a direct replacement or usable with a little rewiring of the socket.
::::::::Lewis
:::::::::
:::::::::
:::::::::
::::::::
::::::::
:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Sir Chip . . . .
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::AND . . . . by the FURTHER reading of the
:::::::fine print
::::::: in the contract of that E-baywatch seller. . . . . .
:::::::
::::::: It seems like that another seller is presently offering a different Tung Sol part number 609 for 'bout 5 Amellican Dollah. It's being glass dome encased, like the more familiar Amperite units.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::PLUSSSSSSS . . . . . that initially referenced sellers other 656 Tung Sol unit had experienced NO takers.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Now if further reference researching finds the heater voltage specs along with the time delay aspect, there is the possibility of a variant of mating the voltage supplied to a relays heater element.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::AND probably, a longer time activation wait would be tolerable, or be NO problem at all.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Another Tung Sol Time Delay Relay offering:
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::> > >Tung Sol 609 Time Delay Relay < < <

:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Its relevant / blanket U.S. patent info:
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::(That's patents covering even an older generation technique . . . . . Which it is referencing . . . . but probably not using, since it utilizes the sag /or/contract effect of hot/cold response of a heated wire. Since the units glass dome WOULD permit viewing, I suspect / prefer the more reliable heater and thermal warp switch technology.)
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::> > >Patent 2074345 Referencing < < <

:::::::
:::::::

:::::::(And then activate . . . . " OPEN THIS CONENT IN ANOTHER WINDOW ")
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Still more Time Delay Relays sources :
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::. . . . . but for sticker shock . . . . . price out a new stock item from current Allied Radio stock.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::> > > Amperite < < <

:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::> > > Old Radio Parts (VERY bottom of page--50x plus units) < < <

:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::> > > Johnnys Gems---Bangkok Thailand . . . . assortment of 25 units < < <

:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::73's de Edd

:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::Early to rise and late to bed makes a man unhealthy, wealthy and DEAD.
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::
:::::::

:::::::
:::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::
::::::Sir Edd:
::::::Have you any idea what the Voltage and contacts are on the original Tung-sol unit???
::::::Varlet Lewis
::::::(whatever that means)
:::::::
::::::
::::::
:::::RIGHT : This unit is used for the Rca model 10T - 200 Colorvolt unit used to regulate a/c voltage for early color tv's. I wish I could find a wiring diagram, the unit did come with instruction, but I have none . The relay is a 3 prong unit(which looks just like the auto relay for Nash cars) 1 lead to transformer 1 lead to one side of the incoming a/c voltage with a string of 2 paired diodes and the last lead to the output outlet that goes to the tv set. I wonder if one could be made, I have looking at auto horn relays , but they are all 12v but I have noticed that the # 678 does come up on Google as PR678 for some of the horn relays listed on the parts express audio store and others?
::::
::::
::::Chip:
::::I think you are way off base with the auto parts. If my thinking is right, this relay heater was in series with the television, and connected the Voltage regulator whenever the TV was turned on, or something like that. It's been a looooonnnnng time since I worked on that kind of stuff, and the memory of it is dim, indeed. I'll look around and see if I can come up with exactly what's going on and let you know.
::::Lewis
:::::
::::
::::
::: WOW; Thank you guys for all the info and right the relay would have to be 120v. I will also ask play things of past if any of his relays would cross for the 678 also the pat # is 2761931. Using a present day timer probably would be the best way to go.
:::
::
::

::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::Sir Chip. . . .
::
::
::AaaaaaaaaH Haaaaa . . . . . more forthcoming info.
::
::
::No more "consumptions" now required . . . . . .BUT with more questions, yet to be answered.
::
::
::First is, HAS that unit been used for the last 50 years, as it was designed for, and that is for an old first generation TV of the 54-60's and their power consumptions of up in 350-450 watts of power ?
::
::
::And mainly, the unit being tied into a poorly regulated AC power line source . . .e.g. . . .like an REA stations line with long power line runs, that could fluctuate wildly with different line loading conditions.
::
::
::Or is it a non working / or failed new toy for you, to be used for . . .I don't know what ?
::
::
::If the LATTER situation and you know nothing about it, let me clue you in just minimally, initially.
::
::
::That unit can take in a low AC line voltage . .say 'bout 90VAC and feed into its internal Sola voltage regulating /resonant saturable reactor transformers primary and automatically will regulate it into the 118-120VAC level.
::
::
:: If your incoming AC line voltage just happens to be in the order of that 118 VAC initially, the transformer core will be going into its saturated threshold a bit and the top and bottom nodes of the AC will be compressed a bit as shown on my illustration.
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::As you up the primary AC input voltage even further towards the transformers upper spec of ~135VAC, those peak nodes will compress down even more and have the once sine wave, compressing on down into a quasi squashed square wave. And then, since the core is so saturated, no stronger magnetic fied will be created to be able to induce a greater magnetic field into the secondary and raise the secondary voltage output.
::
::
::Thereby, by different progressive degrees of going into saturation of the core of the transformer, within the 95-135VAC input range, results in a quite stable output AC voltage.
::
::
::If being used above the nominal 118VAC input the secondary puts out a nastier waveform, the Sola transformer is inherently a bit noisy . . . .HUMMMMMM . . . and it WARMS up a bit and PULLS AC line current even WITHOUTa plugged in load. (Thats due to its transformer needing to be into a subsaturated threshold.)
::
::
::Sooooooo with the latter aspects of the heating up of the unit and its quiescent current consumption, even with no TV load on the unit, we get to the aspect of why there is a relay being associated with the unit.
::
::
::Thats not a good situation to have a " bun warmer " unit setting there plugged in, and pulling 40-60-80 watts continually for 24-7 even if the Color TV is not turned on and THEN pulling its additional slightly less than half a kilowatt.
::
::
::Soooooothat was your relays function.
::
::
::Notice the units AC power cord line that goes over to the AC wall receptacle and additionally, there is the female AC receptacle on the unit that is marked for the load /TV set to be plugged into.
::
::
::The end result, is that the AC into the unit is being disconnected by the relay, until the TV is turned on and that resistance presence has then been detected and initiates the RCA 10-T-200 to then supply regulated AC power to the TV set.
::
::
::When the TV is turned off at the set, all reverts and goes Stone Cold Steve Austin again with the RCA 10-T-200 unit.
::
::
::Soooooo . . . . . If your relay is bad, and you now tell us that it is configured with 3 terminals versus the socket and pins.
::
::
::Lift free, 2 of its 3 terminals external wiring and ohm out between them to ascertain 10's on up to a 100 or so of ohmmage of either a coil winding or thermal heater, in case it's a bimetallic time delay relay. If that test confirms resistance present, then the fault probably will be due to pitted /blackened open relay contacts, from long time switching of a 500 watt load..
::
::
::Thats the point where I would be disassembling the relays cover to see precisely whats inside, to know what corrective action is needed to repair the relay.
::
::
::Yet 2 more workarounds . . .on not using the relay and its load presence capability:
::
::
::Since you are probably NOT using an old classic color TV with it daily, so I would then visually examine, within the relay, to see what 2 of the 3 connections are made between, when the relay activates, and then shunt them with an external wire across those relay terms.
::
::
::Then when you want to use the unit, plug it into the AC wall receptacle or a switched power strip or install a rocker switch inside the RCA 10-T-200 units case in series with the incoming AC line.
::
::
::Finally let us know if the planned use is for a different purpose, other than which the unit was designed for.
::
::
::
::73's de Edd

::
::
::
::
::
::Some ecological circumstantial evidence is very strong, such as when you find a trout in the milk.
::
::
::
::
::
::
::
::

::
::
:
:
:Edd has sparked a little memory here....When the TV was first turned on, the tube filaments were cold and drew a lot more current. The time delay was to let the filaments warm up and draw less current before the regulator was switched into the circuit.
:Lewis
::
::
:
:


OK: The relay is normal/closed, when I remove the middle wire jumper, output wire which bypasses the diodes, and the unit will operate when you plug in something like a 60w light bulb, so I tried my 53 muntz set and the relay starts to click on and off. If you try to bypass the relay all together the unit does not give enough voltage to run a tv set ?



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