I came across this website in trying to locate how to play a disc my brother recorded August 1950. He died 4 months later as a Marine in the Korean War. If anyone knows how to play these 6 1/2" Recordio Discs, please let me know. I woulkd love to hear my brother's voice once again.

Usually these are recorded at 78 rpm. Simply put it on your 78 rpm phonograph equipped with a 3 mil diamond or saphire tip. The needle should track at no more than 14 grammes. 7 is ideal. These records cannot be used on a machine that uses steel needles or that tracks very heavily.

If you do not have a player with the 78 rpm speed, or you are not able to obtain one, I, or someone else with a properly equipped player can record this disc to tape or CD for you.

Thomas

I found your reply to someone asking about a Wilcox-Gay Recordio Disc, slow-burning. I have one also, from 1950. My family made it then. I'd love to find someone who can record it to CD. How can I find them, or you? I know I've heard it (years after it was made) but I can get no sound when I try to play it now.
(your original post below)
Hope you are still checking this..
Susan

Usually these are recorded at 78 rpm. Simply put it on your 78 rpm phonograph equipped with a 3 mil diamond or saphire tip. The needle should track at no more than 14 grammes. 7 is ideal. These records cannot be used on a machine that uses steel needles or that tracks very heavily.
:
:If you do not have a player with the 78 rpm speed, or you are not able to obtain one, I, or someone else with a properly equipped player can record this disc to tape or CD for you.
:
:Thomas

:I'd love to find someone who can record it to CD. How can I find them, or you?

I suggest you find someone local if possible to avoid shipping the fragile disk. It would be sad to have the record damaged or lost in transit...

These play from inside by the hole out ward to the outer edge. That could be why they are not playing for anyone. Reverse direction of a standard record.

:I found your reply to someone asking about a Wilcox-Gay Recordio Disc, slow-burning. I have one also, from 1950. My family made it then. I'd love to find someone who can record it to CD. How can I find them, or you? I know I've heard it (years after it was made) but I can get no sound when I try to play it now.
:(your original post below)
:Hope you are still checking this..
:Susan
:
:
:
:
:
:Usually these are recorded at 78 rpm. Simply put it on your 78 rpm phonograph equipped with a 3 mil diamond or saphire tip. The needle should track at no more than 14 grammes. 7 is ideal. These records cannot be used on a machine that uses steel needles or that tracks very heavily.
::
::If you do not have a player with the 78 rpm speed, or you are not able to obtain one, I, or someone else with a properly equipped player can record this disc to tape or CD for you.
::
::Thomas

:Usually these are recorded at 78 rpm. Simply put it on your 78 rpm phonograph equipped with a 3 mil diamond or saphire tip. The needle should track at no more than 14 grammes. 7 is ideal. These records cannot be used on a machine that uses steel needles or that tracks very heavily.
:
:If you do not have a player with the 78 rpm speed, or you are not able to obtain one, I, or someone else with a properly equipped player can record this disc to tape or CD for you.
:
:Thomas

::Usually these are recorded at 78 rpm. Simply put it on your 78 rpm phonograph equipped with a 3 mil diamond or saphire tip. The needle should track at no more than 14 grammes. 7 is ideal. These records cannot be used on a machine that uses steel needles or that tracks very heavily.
::
::If you do not have a player with the 78 rpm speed, or you are not able to obtain one, I, or someone else with a properly equipped player can record this disc to tape or CD for you.
::
::Thomas

I have also come across 5 Wilcox-Gay records, recorded by my grandfather and grandmother in 1958. I would love to have them transfered to a CD if possible. I do not have a 78rpm phonogragh so I don't even know what condition they are in.Can you give me some guidance or suggestions? Thank you.

:I came across this website in trying to locate how to play a disc my brother recorded August 1950. He died 4 months later as a Marine in the Korean War. If anyone knows how to play these 6 1/2" Recordio Discs, please let me know. I woulkd love to hear my brother's voice once again.

I also came across a 6 1/2" Wilcox-Gay Recordio Disc that my dad made for my mom in 1942, before he was shipped out during WWII. I would love to hear what Dad said to Mom -- they had only been married 5 years, and didn't see each other again for 2 years. He did come home safely from the war but died 12 years ago.
How does one properly clean up this disc and how does one find a record player that has a 78 speed? We have one at home but it only does 33 and 45.

www.crosleyradio.com sells some so-called 78 rpm phonographs. The ideal 78 rpm phonograph has a 3 mil needle. Anything smaller or an "all-speed" needle will ruin 78 rpm records. Don't know what needle theirs uses. They are fairly attractive pieces, so if they have the correct needle, you should be able to enjoy them. You can try antique stores and rummage sales and estate sales. All sorts of places. eBay. If all you're looking to do is play home recorded discs, then all you really need is a VM (Voice of Music) or Webcor (Webster Chicago) or Symphonic, or CBS one tube phono. There are several other brands, too. These little portables are inexpensive and do the job. Perhaps you can check your local school to see if they have any portables they'd like to sell or even give to you. Sadly, schools have abandoned all of their record and 16mm film collections in favor for digital mediums. There is no guarantee that the school phonograph will still have a 78 rpm needle on it, especialy if the needle has been replaced recently. It will likely have the 78 rpm speed. If you purchase an old phonograph, unless it is guaranteed to actually play music, you may need to fix it. The little one tube phonographs are easily repaired, and very often will work with no repairs at all. The most that usually needs attention are the electrolytics, and a little oil on the motor shaft and turntable spindle (perhaps the tone arm bushing as well). Don't get any oil on the rubber drive wheel or any surface it contacts!

As for cleaning records, 78 rpm commercial records are usually made out of shellac. Some very late ones produced towards the 1950s were made of vinyl. Shellac records CANNOT be cleaned with alcohol or any conventional record cleaner. They will be ruined. Vinyl can be cleaned with alcohol, though purists will say this is bad. It does not really affect the record, though. Since most people don't know what on earth a record is made out of, my simple advice is to keep all harsh chemicals away from all records. A good cleaning for 78 rpm records is mild dish detergent and warm water. Use a tooth brush to get the grime out of the grooves.

Home recorded records are made either out of nitro-celluloid, which is extremely flamable, and almost explosive, or a slower burning version of the above. Home recorded discs that are UL rated or are labeled "slow burning" or "safety record," are made out of the slower burning version of nitro-celluloid. Whatever they are made out of, you shouldn't use harsh chemicals on them or you can ruin their quiet playing surfaces. Use gentle soap and water and a soft brush as above.

Thomas

Hi Thomas - I have a "Wilcox-Gay Recordio Disc" from around 1952 that has "33 1/3" and "Slow Burning" on the label (along with a stamp that reads "Compliments of the American Red Cross"). I have a Music Hall MMF 5 turntable with a Grado cartridge - but I'm very concerned about using a diamond stylus. Do you have any info about these Recordio Discs at 33 1/3 speed? What about buying a softer stylus?
Thanks, Phil

When those discs were made, fibre needles were sold specifically for playing them. These needles are very hard to come by now, though. You can check eBay, but you are not likely to find one that will fit your phonograph. Generally, the big danger was playing them on the old set screw cartridges. A jeweled needle would be too rigid in the stiff cartridge, and would unshape the soft walls of the nitro-celluloid groove. With a gentle cartridge in a finer phonograph produced from the early 1950s on, jeweled needles may be used. The higher the quality of the phonograph, generally the higher the quality of the cartridge.

Diamond is perfect, as it does not lose its shape. It does not chip or scuff like saphire. Since it maintains smooth shape, it is ideal for playing nitro-celluloid discs. They should never be played with a steel needle. A saphire will do fine. Saphires, though used a lot on 78 rpm records, are not the greatest for 78 rpm shellac records, as some of the 78 rpm records will have inevitably been played with steel needles, which leave bits of steel in the grooves. These bits of steel chip the saphire. This condition is the only one that renders saphire less than desirable. Saphire is just fine, though, for home recorded discs and vinyl discs.

That said, your diamond will be fine. As for the size, unless the recording artist wrote what size needle they used on the label, you cannot be sure. Typically 33 rpm records are recorded with 1 or 2 mil needles. This being an amateur recording, you can not be certain. Typically 78 rpm home and professional recordings are made with 3 mil needles. You can try your 33 rpm needle (microgroove 1 or 2 mil) on the disc and see how it sounds. If you are able to obtain a 3 mil needle for your phonograph (or if it has tandem needles), you can compare the sound quality of the 3 mil and 2 (or 1) mil sizes. If the record sounds fine with a microgroove needle (1 or 2 mil), then it is likely cut with a microgroove needle. If the sound is somewhat floating, and the needle sounds like it is actually floating around in the grooves, and the sound improves with a 3 mil needle, then it was definitely cut with a 3 mil needle. Examining the grooves and comparing them with those on a professionally recorded 33 and 78 will likely disclose which size was used. As the record may have been cut a bit deep or shallow, sight may not disclose the size, and the groove may appear to be what it is not. All in all, whatever sounds the best and doesn't seem to do harm to the record will do.

The reason why I say 1 or 2 mil for the microgroove needle is that originally, when microgroove records came out (Columbia LPs and RCA Victor 45s), they used a 2 mil needle. When stereophonic records came out, they started using a 1 mil needle instead. 2 mil records can be played with a 1 mil needle, but one of the reasons why the record jackets of the stereo records said that the record cannot be played on monophonic equipment is that the 2 mil needle on the monophonic equipment will widen the groove of a 1 mil record. Actually, for the average listener, no damage is done. Only if your records are played on fine reproducing equipment is the damage noticeable.

Back to playing home recordings:

Lateral (side to side) tracking force should be gentle. These records were often played on the old twisting thumb screw cartridges, so your cartridge is likely better than the above condition. If the needle is rather rigid when pushed side to side, then your cartridge may be a bit stiff laterally. If the following conditions may be met with your phonograph, you likely have proper lateral tracking force, as the following conditions cannot be properly employed unless the above holds true. Vertical tracking force should be no more than 14 grammes at the most. 7 to 2 is preferred, whatever is recommended by the manufacturer of your phonograph. NEVER use too light of a tracking force, as this is just as harmful, if not more so, than a heavy tone arm. The vertical tracking force should be enough to hold the needle in the groove while it is being forced back and forth. If the horizontal tracking force overcomes the vertical tracking force, the needle will bounce in the groove and cause damage. It must be held firmly in the groove. If your phonograph has a recommended vertical tracking force range, use this range. Hopefully it is below 14 grammes. My dad's Dual phonograph (made in Germany) is capable of tracking forces between 2 and 3 grammes. The lateral tracking force is, of course, extremely light, which allows for an extremely light vertical pressure. To do so with my blunderbus steel needle phonograph would cause the needle to gouge out the sides of the grooves and skate across the record. Thankfully I have changed the cartridge on that phonograph to a much gentler one (the Zenith Cobra).

Thomas

Thank you! I'll adjust my tracking & down-force accordingly, and give it a try. I've got several cartridges, and more than a few styli (including a 1 mil - I'll carefully experiment). I'm thinking it was recorded by my father (who was in Korea & Japan in the early 50's) to my mother. The disc cleaned up quite nicely using distilled water & a little dishwashing detergent (gently applied).

Groovy! (literally)

I forgot.....a Grado cartridge is a very nice one. That company made very high end equipment.

T.

Thomas:

Are you sure you're only 28 years old?

While reading the thoroughness of your replies I cannot help but revel in the depth and breadth of your knowledge ... and in the fact that you are a walking-talking human "compendium" of old record player stylus information ( among so many other areas of old things and probably mummy dust too... that you have a "lock on")
You never cease to amaze me.
You do realize don't you... what an asset (read treasure) that you are to this forum?

... that's my humble opinion at least.

:When those discs were made, fibre needles were sold specifically for playing them.

Fiber needles were a Hi-Fi "fad". They were not made for any specific purpose. Hi-Fi buffs of the time prefer fiber needles as they filtered the high frequencies where most of the noise is (surface etc) and made recordings sound "softer" (no pun intended).

Z-

:Hi Thomas - I have a "Wilcox-Gay Recordio Disc" from around 1952 that has "33 1/3" and "Slow Burning" on the label (along with a stamp that reads "Compliments of the American Red Cross"). I have a Music Hall MMF 5 turntable with a Grado cartridge - but I'm very concerned about using a diamond stylus. Do you have any info about these Recordio Discs at 33 1/3 speed? What about buying a softer stylus?
:Thanks, Phil

::Hi Thomas - I have a "Wilcox-Gay Recordio Disc" from around 1952 that has "33 1/3" and "Slow Burning" on the label (along with a stamp that reads "Compliments of the American Red Cross"). I have a Music Hall MMF 5 turntable with a Grado cartridge - but I'm very concerned about using a diamond stylus. Do you have any info about these Recordio Discs at 33 1/3 speed? What about buying a softer stylus?
::Thanks, Phil

i also have a wilcox Gasy recordio disc 1951 some helen on peano

Sorry about the previous reply.
I have a disc made by me in 1944 (when I was 4) that was sent to my soldier father in Europe. I sent it away to be transferred to CD by a company that does such things. It was really in very bad condition but some the recorded voice does come through. There was no way I could play the original on any equipment.
This does not answer you question, but I thought it might be of interest anyway.

Hello there,

Great info, I just bought a bunch of old records and while searching through my treasure of records I found some records that seem to be made of glass with some kind of vinyl over the glass. There is a center hole and then another over to the side. None of them have labels and I would love to be able to hear them. Any ideas what these are or when they were made. They are the size of 78's. They are very neat. Some only have recordings on one side. I also found a few of the ones you have listed here in this message.

If anyone knows anything about the records I have just mentioned please, please email me at: hottie3467@yahoo.com

Thanks a ton.

Cheers, Inga

:www.crosleyradio.com sells some so-called 78 rpm phonographs. The ideal 78 rpm phonograph has a 3 mil needle. Anything smaller or an "all-speed" needle will ruin 78 rpm records. Don't know what needle theirs uses. They are fairly attractive pieces, so if they have the correct needle, you should be able to enjoy them. You can try antique stores and rummage sales and estate sales. All sorts of places. eBay. If all you're looking to do is play home recorded discs, then all you really need is a VM (Voice of Music) or Webcor (Webster Chicago) or Symphonic, or CBS one tube phono. There are several other brands, too. These little portables are inexpensive and do the job. Perhaps you can check your local school to see if they have any portables they'd like to sell or even give to you. Sadly, schools have abandoned all of their record and 16mm film collections in favor for digital mediums. There is no guarantee that the school phonograph will still have a 78 rpm needle on it, especialy if the needle has been replaced recently. It will likely have the 78 rpm speed. If you purchase an old phonograph, unless it is guaranteed to actually play music, you may need to fix it. The little one tube phonographs are easily repaired, and very often will work with no repairs at all. The most that usually needs attention are the electrolytics, and a little oil on the motor shaft and turntable spindle (perhaps the tone arm bushing as well). Don't get any oil on the rubber drive wheel or any surface it contacts!
:
:As for cleaning records, 78 rpm commercial records are usually made out of shellac. Some very late ones produced towards the 1950s were made of vinyl. Shellac records CANNOT be cleaned with alcohol or any conventional record cleaner. They will be ruined. Vinyl can be cleaned with alcohol, though purists will say this is bad. It does not really affect the record, though. Since most people don't know what on earth a record is made out of, my simple advice is to keep all harsh chemicals away from all records. A good cleaning for 78 rpm records is mild dish detergent and warm water. Use a tooth brush to get the grime out of the grooves.
:
:Home recorded records are made either out of nitro-celluloid, which is extremely flamable, and almost explosive, or a slower burning version of the above. Home recorded discs that are UL rated or are labeled "slow burning" or "safety record," are made out of the slower burning version of nitro-celluloid. Whatever they are made out of, you shouldn't use harsh chemicals on them or you can ruin their quiet playing surfaces. Use gentle soap and water and a soft brush as above.
:
:Thomas

Hi Shirley, Perhaps you already got to play your record.
But if not, I would suggest this. If you do get a setup to play the 78 rpm record, make sure you have it playing correctly first, BEFORE testing it on your fathers disc.
Then connect the player to some kind of recording device whether it be a cassette recorder, or whatever. Make sure everything works. Set volume, tone etc. Test record a sample record.
The reason is simple. Sometimes these discs will play only once or twice satisfactoraly, (depending on the makeup of the disc) so if you tape record the first playing, you will ensure that you'll have a record of it, just in case it is damaged somehow. It is unlikely that it will be damaged, but this is cheap insurance, just in case. Just pretend this disc will play only once, and you must capture it at the first play. You would not want to lose your father's voice, just in case the needle cut the disc or the coating flaked off, or....
Good luck , and let us know how it turned out.
Take care!
Gary Rabbitt
:I came across this website in trying to locate how to play a disc my brother recorded August 1950. He died 4 months later as a Marine in the Korean War. If anyone knows how to play these 6 1/2" Recordio Discs, please let me know. I woulkd love to hear my brother's voice once again.

I have a disc I recorded in 1944 (I was four years old) that was sent to my soldier father in Europe. Mine is quite badly cracked. I sent it away to a company in Florida that specializes in transfers to CD. They were able to do a fairly decent job in spite of the damage (mostly cracks on the surface). They first digitize the recording and then do electronic "repairs". If yours is in pretty good shape the CD they can do will be better than the original. An aluminum disc my father sent me from England in 1945 came out remarkably well. It is very satisfying to have both of these on CD.
I would highly recommend this and you will hear your brother's voice again. My sympathies to you.
I probably will not check this web page again. But you can respond to bobandpris@msn.com.

:I came across this website in trying to locate how to play a disc my brother recorded August 1950. He died 4 months later as a Marine in the Korean War. If anyone knows how to play these 6 1/2" Recordio Discs, please let me know. I woulkd love to hear my brother's voice once again.

I have a player-recorder b Wilcox-gay. Is anyone interested in it?? It's about the size of small chest of drawers. There are some recodings with it and perhaps a black 1 or 2

Located in Washington State.

Richard

::I came across this website in trying to locate how to play a disc my brother recorded August 1950. He died 4 months later as a Marine in the Korean War. If anyone knows how to play these 6 1/2" Recordio Discs, please let me know. I woulkd love to hear my brother's voice once again.
:
:I have a player-recorder b Wilcox-gay. Is anyone interested in it?? It's about the size of small chest of drawers. There are some recodings with it and perhaps a black 1 or 2
:
:Located in Washington State.
:
:Richard
:
I have one of these disks too. Listening to it I'm amazed that I went on to become a radio announcer. Anyway, mine has a hole because of the screw drive. I put a piece of double sided tape under it and it plays, (from outside in) on any 78 rpm player.
Terry